The black athlete

[teamchemistry09]

I am by no means a racist. (Just wanting to get that out of the way) But I would like to know why you all think that the black athlete has taken over the sports world. They have always been there, yes, but for every Wilt and Oscar there was a Walton and Pistol Pete. For every Magic there was Bird, every Hammerin Hank there was Gerhig (SP) and for every Payton there was a Nammath. There has always been dominant black athletes in every game (with the exception of golf, tennis, and hockey) but there has been the dominant white athlete to go along with them. But what about todays game? Sure there are the Mannings, Clemens, and Nashs of the world. But do they really amount to the likes of Tomlinson, Bonds, or Kobes? We all know they dont, but why not? Is it because the white athletes just arent as good? Or do they just think they arent as good and chose to take a different route in life? Do they live in the shadows because they are white? What has happened to the Birds, Steve Youngs, and Nolan Ryans? Why are they just now starting to show up in golf and tennis with Woods and the Williams sisters? Just thought it would be nice to have a conversation about a topic that comes up all the time in the sports world.

[Mino859]

We dont need threads like this

[PitinoLooksBetterInRed]

I am by no means a racist. (Just wanting to get that out of the way) But I would like to know why you all think that the black athlete has taken over the sports world. They have always been there, yes, but for every Wilt and Oscar there was a Walton and Pistol Pete. For every Magic there was Bird, every Hammerin Hank there was Gerhig (SP) and for every Payton there was a Nammath. There has always been dominant black athletes in every game (with the exception of golf, tennis, and hockey) but there has been the dominant white athlete to go along with them. But what about todays game? Sure there are the Mannings, Clemens, and Nashs of the world. But do they really amount to the likes of Tomlinson, Bonds, or Kobes? We all know they dont, but why not? Is it because the white athletes just arent as good? Or do they just think they arent as good and chose to take a different route in life? Do they live in the shadows because they are white? What has happened to the Birds, Steve Youngs, and Nolan Ryans? Why are they just now starting to show up in golf and tennis with Woods and the Williams sisters? Just thought it would be nice to have a conversation about a topic that comes up all the time in the sports world.

Hard to tell for sure, but its obviously no coincidence in the differences now (i'll just talk about b-ball) in the nba and what it was like 20, 30 years ago. I've heard many people say it as that, 30 years ago everyone had to put atleast 1 black player on their roster, partly so no one could talk about being racist, while now you see maybe one or two white players on each roster. I have no numbers to support it, but my general belief is that there are currently a lot more black families in poverty than white families. And when you look at places like the bronx or NJ there are some kids who grow up dreaming of making the nba dollars, and that the only way to get out on top is to make the nba. I'm one of the believers that if want you something bad enough you can work your tail off and get it, and these black athletes have that inner drive that i didnt have for basketball. I think i put that "drive" towards a different direction in my life. I dont think at all that black players are born stronger and more agile, its got a lot to do with the differences in how we're brought up. I think there are way, way too many spoiled white kids.
Thats my two cents. I've talked about this issue with only a couple of people so im interested to see what some ppls opinions are.

[PitinoLooksBetterInRed]

We dont need threads like this

Its talked about a LOT on TV. If you dont want to or feel uncomfortable talking about it, you dont have to. I think its good T.C. brought it up.

[surveyor]

Largely due to desire, ambition and fewer available avenues to pursuit. Most white kids pursue sports as a hobby early on moreso than a means of employment and $$$. Certainly that changes as they get older.

It also has something to do with marketing (especially with regard to football and basketball - moreso basketball).
Further, basketball is a relatively cheap sport to get involved in. Plenty of courts available in urban areas, and take up much less space than say, baseball fields.

It's probably not much difference than the success of latin american players in baseball. These kids have practically no chance at all out of poverty except for becoming a successful baseball player. Thus, the desire and ambition will be much stronger than that of kids who have many more options.

Just my 2 cents.

[DCWildcat]

At various times, I've heard that people of African descent can sustain a lower body fat percentage, and that they tend to be born with more fast twitch muscles. Not sure if those are true, though.

[Will Lavender]

We dont need threads like this

I see nothing wrong with the thread. If you can't talk about race on a sports forum, where can you talk about it? Race and sports are inexorably related; they are, essentially, versions of the same discussion.

Teamchemistry:

If you're a reader, you might like David Shields's Black Planet. Finest discussion of race and basketball I've ever read. Tremendously profound book full of insights about race and racism and white fans' relationships toward black players.

[sojourner]

I am by no means a racist. (Just wanting to get that out of the way) But I would like to know why you all think that the black athlete has taken over the sports world. They have always been there, yes, but for every Wilt and Oscar there was a Walton and Pistol Pete. For every Magic there was Bird, every Hammerin Hank there was Gerhig (SP) and for every Payton there was a Nammath. There has always been dominant black athletes in every game (with the exception of golf, tennis, and hockey) but there has been the dominant white athlete to go along with them. But what about todays game? Sure there are the Mannings, Clemens, and Nashs of the world. But do they really amount to the likes of Tomlinson, Bonds, or Kobes? We all know they dont, but why not? Is it because the white athletes just arent as good? Or do they just think they arent as good and chose to take a different route in life? Do they live in the shadows because they are white? What has happened to the Birds, Steve Youngs, and Nolan Ryans? Why are they just now starting to show up in golf and tennis with Woods and the Williams sisters? Just thought it would be nice to have a conversation about a topic that comes up all the time in the sports world.

An awful lot of it deals with desire and opportunity. There has been some discussion lately about how there are less black baseball players than in the past. It isn't as though the game has really changed. The argument is that the inner city kids can't find places to play baseball. So the opportunity is not there.

I always found Tiger Woods to be an interesting example as he is as much Asian as he is black. Why is he always considered only as black?

[surveyor]

An awful lot of it deals with desire and opportunity. There has been some discussion lately about how there are less black baseball players than in the past. It isn't as though the game has really changed. The argument is that the inner city kids can't find places to play baseball. So the opportunity is not there.

I always found Tiger Woods to be an interesting example as he is as much Asian as he is black. Why is he always considered only as black?

An interesting op-ed in this week's ESPN Magazine sort of bears this out and what I posted earlier.
Another factor noted in the article is that inner city kids gravitate towards sports that will likely yield a scholarship - football and basketball. Many more scholly's are available for those sports, as they are THE revenue generating sports in college athletics. Fewer FULL scholarships are available for baseball. Thus, football and basketball get the lionshare of the black athletes.
Further, the article opined that the success and proliferation of black athletes in other sports was a testiment to Robinson breaking the color barrier in baseball.:thumbup:

[BOURBON TOWN CAT FAN]

At various times, I've heard that people of African descent can sustain a lower body fat percentage, and that they tend to be born with more fast twitch muscles. Not sure if those are true, though.


I remember Jimmy the Greek being fired over making similar remarks.

[surveyor]

I remember Jimmy the Greek being fired over making similar remarks.

What Snyder said was quite abit different:

The black is the better athlete, and he practices to be the better athlete, and he's bred to be the better athlete because this goes way back to the slave period. The slave owner would breed this big black with this big black woman so he could have a big black kid.
That's where it all started."

[scathendo]

my thought... 1. socio-economic, 2. evolution

look at the history of sport in this country. non-country-club sports like boxing, football and baseball have been dominated by people who grew up poor (black or irish or italian or hispanic, whatever). when there is not alot of money, there's not alot of junk food. there's also not alot of time for for sitting around and getting fat. more than likely there's been hard labor involved from a very young age, either for pay or just because it's the chores that needed to be done (like on a farm). a friend of mine who was a scholarship track athlete at La Tech told me about his friends in high school who would come back from working the shrimp boats all summer and just dominate the high school football scene. they didn't spend the summer playing playstation and eating cheetos. so i think that's part of the reason.

another reason, again IMO, that has to do with the black athlete in pariticular is evolution for survival in a hot climate. kenyans just run farther-faster because there body style has developed over eons to do so. a black athlete, IMO, seems to have a particular athletic skillset that is important for success in the popular american sports. on the flip side, watch the strong man competitions and you'll see alot of swedes, fins, icelanders. guys with names like magnus ver magnusson. the highlander games (my people) are the same way. tree trunks for legs. power and explosiveness and atheleticism but a different skill set. one that developed over eons for survival in those climates. skin color, body mass, body proportion, hair...everything has evolved to help people of all races to survive in their climates.

btw, i don't think it's racist to think that there are, in general, differences in peoples but it's also ignorant to think that there are not exceptions.