Did anyone notice the ESPN poll today?

[TRexSmarts]

Neo Zeo wrote: Why do a lot of people feel there is a media bias against Kentucky basketball? I don't get it. Clearly there is a media lovefest with Duke, but I have yet to see anything anti-UK. If anything, they favor UK. It gets really tiring everytime Dicky V drools over the fact that Ashley Judd is at a game.
Neo,

Then how can you explain UK not being in that poll then? We ranked higher than Villanova all year but yet they got into the poll!

TRexSmarts

[TRexSmarts]

True, they did beat Kansas and do have all five guys returning but that doesn't mean they should be on that list. We are the top program in the US. We have most wins than any program. Not to mention best record over the past 3 years. Villanova did good for one year and that deserves them more respect than UK?

TRexSmarts

[WildcatLraiser]

Yeah, Oklahoma is definatly going to be tough and a title contender. But no matter who was on that list there was going to be complaining going onacross boards that were not mentioned.

[CoreyDavis]

Villanova will be solid, because they have the ability to shoot with people guarding them. They are a lot like Georgia Tech the year they went to the title game, but as we all saw didn't do as much this season. Villanova will not be overlooked this season, but they have one of the best teams in the nation coming up, but the Big East will be L-O-A-D-E-D.

[WildcatLraiser]

That has absolutly nothing to do w/ biased against UK. That was just one hell of a game with one hell of an ending. It's such a popular shot it's knows as "the shot."

Dont get me wrong i hate seeing it as much as the next uk fan. but that has nothing to do w/ biased against uk.

[WildcatLraiser]

Ha, nice post neo. Great minds think alike. We were posting the same thing at the same timehuh.

[WildcatLraiser]

UK_wildcat_fanatic wrote: People hit game-winning shots all the time, but we don't get constantly bombarded with them. And if it's got nothing to do with disliking UK, why do we never see clips from the 1998 Duke game? That game surely had as much as/more significance than the other. Both games were down-to-the-wire, both were in the Elite Eight, and in both games the winner went on to win the National Championship.

I'm interested to know why you don't think the media hates UK.

I think that its ridiculous to think that they are biased to uk. I made my point. You can't expect not to see the most popular college basketball shot ever made not to be replayed consistantly during march madness.

I'm interested to know why you think they do hate uk. Do you have anymore examples?? That one just isn't convincing me that the media hates uk.

[WildcatLraiser]

Neo Zeo wrote: Because they don't hate UK. You can only name one example, an thats not even concrete evidence. Every time our games are on CBS or ESPN the commentaters always praise our program (and rightfully so). In the 1998 game, their wasn't a buzzer beater. Once again, like I previously posted, many people consider the 1992 game the greatest college basketball game of all time. Also once again, don't view it as an anti-UK theme, view it as another lovefest for Duke.

P.S. They show the Valpo shot against Ole Miss (or Georgia, not sure) every year. Does that mean they are biased against Ole Miss?

No, kidding.

Or how about the UNC v Georgtwon '82. are they biased against georgetown?

Or how about the NCST v Houson '83. are they biased against houston too???

No they are not biased, those were great shots, in great games, and they will continue to show these baskets every march.....over, and over, and over, and over, ect.

[WildcatLraiser]

wildcat88 wrote: I think that ESPN is a little anti-UK. They kept waving us off last year as a real contender because of our youth. Probably the reason that ukwf couldn't think of specific examples of when ESPN was disrespectful of us was because of the fact that we weren't mentioned. We weren't mentioned when they were discussing the best teams in the nation, the teams that had a chance at winning it all, or evento win the SEC. They were picking Bama over us. That is where i get my opinion of ESPN's disrespect of UK.

That was their pre-season pick.

And did you expect UK to have the season they had this year before it began?? I know I didn't.

[WildcatLraiser]

UK_wildcat_fanatic wrote: Hey, you said one example, just doing what you asked. How many times in a normal week of college basketball do they mention us on SportsCenter? Even the day after one of our games, we get the minimum highlight slot of about 30 seconds. They show a couple of decent plays and then the final score.

Every time Kentucky would climb the rankings last season (or this season, whichever, the 2004-05 season), ESPN.com's Power 16 would reiterate how we didn't deserve our ranking and that we climbed more because others lost than we won. The boys on PTI threw out nothing but bad stuff, saying that the only reason we might possibly have won would've been the depth. They don't even take into account that we have one of the best defenses in the nation and that when we're shooting the ball well we can beat nearly any team in the country.

I do agree that the media loves Duke, for whatever reason, but it seems that the shot is the most played shot in NCAA history. It was over a decade ago, and even though it's a classic, the UK fans don't need a constant reminder of what happened. We remember, and so does everyone else.

We appear on ESPN and their website very little. CBS is usually pretty good about being fair to UK, but ESPN's analysts are biased. Digger Phelps hates UK, and there's no way you can admit he doesn't. Billy Packer hates UK, but he's pretty much the only one at CBS who's that bad. Jay Bilas will throw UK the occasional compliment, but most everyone else like Andy Katz and Joe Lunardi dislike UK. It's not that ESPN hates UK, it's the fact that their analysts do.

The fact that we aren't in that poll isn't a media bias, in my opinion. If there were a 5th spot I think we would've seen Kentucky's name there. I just think that judging by how we've been treated by them in the past that they have some sort of bias against us. We're the winningest team in college basketball and I think that they just like seeing us lose. Just what I think.
Yeah, but thats a UK fan speaking. You know that someone from every other school is saying the exact same stuff you are, about their programs.You got to understand that everything you read isread throughan UK fans eyes. Plus, Uk hasnt been to the final four in 7 years, you cant expect them to be worshiping our program at this point.

[WildcatLraiser]

wildcat88 wrote: actually i did expect us to go that far.I predicted since day one that we would go all the way. But that wasn't just the preseason, they did that all season long. Jay Bilas didn't predict us to go to the final four until we started playing well in the tourny and Duke lost. No one predicted us to go that far and when we did it was a fluke according to them. But it is all in the past and we will all be laughing this time next year when number 8 is hanging up in rupp lol.


Indeed!!:ggrin:

[pdt542]

Espn picks what highlights go where and how long they are based on how entertaining they will be. Of course we want to see the UK highlights, even though all of us probably watched the whole game, but if it wasn't an exciting game and there weren't many exciting plays they aren't going to spend a lot of time on us. When we play teams like Ole Miss, Tenn., Auburn, etc. nobody else in the country wants to watch. But when we play Florida, UNC, Kansas, and Louisville we get more air time. I don't see a bias at all.

[pdt542]

I don't really care that much. I don't need Sports Center to keep up with the cats. If there is a game then I'm finding a way to watch it.

[WildcatLraiser]

Yeah, i wish the SEC would stop sucking. We got UK and LSU this year.

[UkFanatic]

the commentators and "experts" really dont give a whole lot of love

[pdt542]

Neo is right, looking way too into this. And other teams like Duke were much more marketable over the past few seasons.

[ukfrigginrules]

though i would like to see us get some respect, i kinda like us being underrated then doing big things, like this year and in 03.

so i dont really mind

[xukfan]

kentucky gets more respect than it deserves. with the coach they have, it is lucky they get any at all. look how many times they have been given a straight shot to the final four only to lose. i do believe that they are playing to the best of their abilities, the only problem is with tubby, they will never do any better than they have. until other sec teams get better, the illusion of uk's greatness will continue. you will be stuck with the coach you have and lack of true respect that uk deserves. tubby was a political hire and that political correctness that is continueing should be ending very soon. he was given the best program in college bball while it was at the top and has let it slip. it is now in a rut and stagnet. how many years will it take for you so-called uk fans to jump off of the political bandwagon and start demanding that the program get back to the greatness it had when he was hired. unless things change, uk will never win the final four again. 7 years and counting for the one hit wonder

[WildcatLraiser]

xukfan wrote: kentucky gets more respect than it deserves. with the coach they have, it is lucky they get any at all. look how many times they have been given a straight shot to the final four only to lose. i do believe that they are playing to the best of their abilities, the only problem is with tubby, they will never do any better than they have. until other sec teams get better, the illusion of uk's greatness will continue. you will be stuck with the coach you have and lack of true respect that uk deserves. tubby was a political hire and that political correctness that is continueing should be ending very soon. he was given the best program in college bball while it was at the top and has let it slip. it is now in a rut and stagnet. how many years will it take for you so-called uk fans to jump off of the political bandwagon and start demanding that the program get back to the greatness it had when he was hired. unless things change, uk will never win the final four again. 7 years and counting for the one hit wonder


hahahaha! alright man. Guess only timecan tell.

[xukfan]

time...... how much time? 8yrs, 10yrs, 20yrs. tubby may be the best man on the planet, just not a great coach. he is average at best. if he were anywhere else, we would not even hear about him. just keep waiting for next year and next year , etc. if Pitino, donovan or any other coach were the head man at uk, they would have been gone2 to 3 years ago. tubby has been and is getting a free pass. we all know why. time to get over the political aspects and move on. time to get back to basketball.

[ukfrigginrules]

xukfan wrote: kentucky gets more respect than it deserves. with the coach they have, it is lucky they get any at all. look how many times they have been given a straight shot to the final four only to lose. i do believe that they are playing to the best of their abilities, the only problem is with tubby, they will never do any better than they have. until other sec teams get better, the illusion of uk's greatness will continue. you will be stuck with the coach you have and lack of true respect that uk deserves. tubby was a political hire and that political correctness that is continueing should be ending very soon. he was given the best program in college bball while it was at the top and has let it slip. it is now in a rut and stagnet. how many years will it take for you so-called uk fans to jump off of the political bandwagon and start demanding that the program get back to the greatness it had when he was hired. unless things change, uk will never win the final four again. 7 years and counting for the one hit wonder


you are ignorant, and i see no reason why you are on a uk website.

tubby is a great coach, not as good as patino, but i wouldnt ever take him back.

second, tubby is good and got a 10 year extension after the 03 season cuz of what he did.

there isnt a single coach i would rather have at uk right now.



if you dont have someone better then him, then why complain about a problem that you have no solution for???

plz give names of coaches you would rather have, and would have a chance, and want to go to uk, and be willing to leave his team right now. think realistically.

[ukfrigginrules]

well, take this year for example. we started 2 freshies, lost 3 starters last season and the top benchy, only had 1 senior that mattered. and yet we barely lost in the elite 8. i like being underrated cuz then when we do good its all the mores amazing.

and when you are the top team you are focused on, just like the illini this year. when they lost to ohio state, people were going crazy.

[CoreyDavis]

When people question Tubby, I ask who would in reality take thejob and do as well as Tubby has had? Not many, I mean Joe B. Hall took this same gossip.

[WildcatLraiser]

CoreyDavis wrote: When people question Tubby, I ask who would in reality take thejob and do as well as Tubby has had? Not many, I mean Joe B. Hall took this same gossip.Only personI could possibly think of would be Pat Riley.

[WildcatDan]

xukfan wrote: time...... how much time? 8yrs, 10yrs, 20yrs. tubby may be the best man on the planet, just not a great coach. he is average at best. if he were anywhere else, we would not even hear about him. just keep waiting for next year and next year , etc. if Pitino, donovan or any other coach were the head man at uk, they would have been gone2 to 3 years ago. tubby has been and is getting a free pass. we all know why. time to get over the political aspects and move on. time to get back to basketball.


So your theory is that the only reason Tubby has kept his job is because he is black? Am I reading you correctly?

If he had made the final four this year would you still be saying that? Would one more rebound, one more madefree throw, one less hard foul on Bradley have made Tubby a great coach in your eyes?

Tubby IS a great coach. I doubt that anyone could have done anything more than what he did with Team Turmoil and the teams he had the following years. Recruiting is getting back on track and I expect great things from our returning players.

[pdt542]

I say xukfan should be an xmember of our board.

[pdt542]

oops, didn't mean to repeat

[WildcatDan]

pdt542 wrote: I say xukfan should be an xmember of our board.


Nah, we have to keep someone around to argue with!

[pdt542]

I just hate Tubby Bashers.

[WildcatDan]

I feel your pain brother.

[xukfan]

if you want to use that phase, "tubby bashers", to pigeon hole people who want to see the uk program get back to elite status, so be it. however, your support for him will only keep the program at status quo. i don't care what color the man is, i would just like to see the program in different hands. it is in a rut. i hear the same arguements year after year, stating how the program has improved and how no other coach could have won with the 98 team or no other coach could have handled the team turmoil. 1st, that 98 team had a lot of seniors who took over the team and won it. and if tubby was so good then with players he was not so familar with, why can't he do it with his own players. also, when tubby took over the georgia team, it had won 20 games the year before. in his first year, they won 10. so, the arguement that he was the only coach for the 98 team does not hold water. 2nd, team turmoil was a result of his recruiting, his players. another thing, this so called improvement is the result of a weak non-conference schedule, as reported by the herald leader, and a very weak sec.even when they are given a favorites role in the tournament, they fall short. the uk name still means something, butit has lost its glow. i, also, don't believer uk is getting a lot of respect from national media, because they see the same thing a lot of people see. when mentioning the uk program, they will say that tubby is a great coach and then move on to other topics very quickly. what else can they say. they are aware of the political ramifications of any negative comments. this brings us to racial thing. you can't really believe that his race didn't factor into his hiring. the AD at the time, already had the distinction of bringing the first blach athelete to alabama, so he wanted to be the first person to hire a black man as coach of uk. this also helped defer some of the heat uk had been getting over past decrepencies. everyone in the state of kentucky knew that uk was going to hire a black coach. most people though it would be clem haskins. ncaa violations at minn. prevented that. i was very glad that they had hired a pitino desciple. it is sad that he learned very little from pitino. no one can be happy with 50 and 60 point games. sadly, i do believe that he is getting a free pass to some degree because of his race now. if he were white, he would already have been gone. i had been a avid uk basketball supporter since the early 70's. i knew after the first year that we would never win another championship with tubby as head man. when they did win in 98, it gave him a grace period. i believe that marker has been covered. time to move on. when pitino starts winning every game, you will agree with me and many others who are not blinded by blue or are wearing blue colored classes.

[CrowdControl]

Well stated.. but you are off in your thinking.

I am not going to change your paradigm and you are welcome to your opinion, how ever far off you are.:shock:

[pdt542]

You are a nut, Pitino hand picked Tubby. Not because he was black. C.M. wouldn't have hired him without Pitino's support. The state of Kentucky didn't know that we were going to hire a black coach. The state of Kentucky knew that we would hire a Pitino assistant. Tubby was the best, and still is. I can't complain about him making teams do better than they are suppose to. The fact is each of the last three years he has taken teams that were ranked out of the top ten preseason and made them top five teams. After the recruiting class he had last year you can't complain about his recruiting, and after loosing four seniors with significant PT you can't complain about the season we had last year. Great job Tubby. Don't listen to these idiots. I'm excited about UK's future and you have your blinders on if you aren't. The state of Kentucky basketball is VERY HEALTHY. GO CATS. GO TUBBY.

[pdt542]

I don't know why I even waisted my time. CC is right. I'm not going to change your mind. Go to a DUKE message board.

[xukfan]

well..... probably not going to go. like it here. you my friend are one of those typical uk fans who wear blue blinders. so you like low scoring games. you like the fact that tubby has had only one good recruiting class in 7-8 years. you like the fact that they haven't been to final four for 7 yrs. you like the fact that florida has beat them 2 straight games. you like the fact that the national media has little to say about uk bball. you also like weak non-conference games. you are easy. you are a typical of the fan whose expectations have sunk so low that you are happy when uk makes it to sweet sixteen and are delierious when they get to final eight. you sound like the fellow i heard on one of the local talk shows. his comment was that he liked tubby so well that he didn't care if they ever got to the final four again. he was so happy that tubby was coach. as i said before, tubby may be a great fellow, you or i neither one really know that for a fact, he just is not the man to get uk bball back to elite status. he was given the best program in bball, when it was at it's zenith, and has taken it down a peg and you with it. there once was a time in uk's past when fans expected greatness. now it is political correctness. feel good tactics. that is all well and good, however if you want superior basketball, you are missing the boat. the sport of basketball should be played as a game and for fun, not used as a tool to promote someones political agenda. keep telling everyone how much you love tubby, but don't call yourself a true blue basketball fan.

[pdt542]

Your a jackass. The fact is that it isn't easy to get to the final four. Ofcourse I'm not happy that they aren't there. But they will be very soon. Everyone on this site is a True BlueKentucky fan except you. Hence, xukfan. I seem to remember UK beating Florida 7 straight times. They can't win them all. You are one of those fans that cries on the radio after every loss. It is a much more competitive game these days compared to your so called zenith. I'd like to see you get out there and do what Tubby does. Tell me who you want. There is a reason that Tubby is in the running for national coach of the year each year. I always have been a UK fan and I always will be. Wheather they are a top ten team or not. Unlike you who gives up on your team and your coach. You will be singing a different tune after the next couple of years. Mark my words. Then if they lose their first game you will want to run Tubby out of town. That isn't a true blue Kentucky fan. I bet you are a Yankees fan too, and want Joe Torre ran out.

[xukfan]

don't get to upset. it's only basketball talk. however, you are the kind of fan that barnhart likes. he doesn't have much work to please you. your say the typical phrases we hear every year, like "you can't win them all". you reallly don't expect them to, now do you. that'sone of the problems. everyone's expectations are so low, they don't expect much.the games are more of an event like the nba. you buy the merchandise and go to the event. not important who they play or really if they win. you also eluded to the fact thatin the next few years things will be better. heard that before to. probably will continue to hear it as longas tubby is around. my friend, you will get what you want. you like mediocrecy, yougot it. just keep waiting for next year. things will surely get better. right. as far as me being the only one here who doesn't support uk, you may be right. i now pull against the bball team. until things really get better, i refuse to support something i know will not be successful. there are many more people like me. they just are tired of trying to get you to see the light. one day, you might. until then, consider this. you are being used by the system. get in line and just accept what ever you are told by the uk team. they love you.

[matt57]

xukfan wrote: don't get to upset. it's only basketball talk. however, you are the kind of fan that barnhart likes. he doesn't have much work to please you. your say the typical phrases we hear every year, like "you can't win them all". you reallly don't expect them to, now do you. that'sone of the problems. everyone's expectations are so low, they don't expect much.the games are more of an event like the nba. you buy the merchandise and go to the event. not important who they play or really if they win. you also eluded to the fact thatin the next few years things will be better. heard that before to. probably will continue to hear it as longas tubby is around. my friend, you will get what you want. you like mediocrecy, yougot it. just keep waiting for next year. things will surely get better. right. as far as me being the only one here who doesn't support uk, you may be right. i now pull against the bball team. until things really get better, i refuse to support something i know will not be successful. there are many more people like me. they just are tired of trying to get you to see the light. one day, you might. until then, consider this. you are being used by the system. get in line and just accept what ever you are told by the uk team. they love you.


wow???? this is absurd.......i mean is the elite 8 not good enough????? i'm literally dumbfounded.....and people seem to wonder why UK fans get a bad rep.....see above......

[CrowdControl]

xukfan wrote: don't get to upset. it's only basketball talk. however, you are the kind of fan that barnhart likes. he doesn't have much work to please you. your say the typical phrases we hear every year, like "you can't win them all". you reallly don't expect them to, now do you. that'sone of the problems. everyone's expectations are so low, they don't expect much.the games are more of an event like the nba. you buy the merchandise and go to the event. not important who they play or really if they win. you also eluded to the fact thatin the next few years things will be better. heard that before to. probably will continue to hear it as longas tubby is around. my friend, you will get what you want. you like mediocrecy, yougot it. just keep waiting for next year. things will surely get better. right. as far as me being the only one here who doesn't support uk, you may be right. i now pull against the bball team. until things really get better, i refuse to support something i know will not be successful. there are many more people like me. they just are tired of trying to get you to see the light. one day, you might. until then, consider this. you are being used by the system. get in line and just accept what ever you are told by the uk team. they love you.
you are a small bitter man.

I pity your family.

[xukfan]

get that ring out of your nose and face facts. uk, like all big programs, is all about your money. if you support garbage, you get it. the program will not turn around until fans demand it. you won't demand anything except what you see in front of you. meanwhile, barnhart and tubby are laughing all the way to the bank. they know they don't have to do anything other than what they are doing. you really don't care. status quo is alright with you.

[CrowdControl]

Status Quo? You think we havent changed? Wow.

If you have that paradigm.. then again, I pity you.

Such tunnel vision is really bad.

[CrowdControl]

one shot away from the final four and we are floundering... wow.

[xukfan]

always one shot, one foul, one injury, one free throw, one something. really, it is one coach. college bball is certainly different here in kentucky. louisville is surging and uk has flatlined. gonna be that way until tubby leaves. pitino takes programs in trouble and gets them to final four. tubby takes programs and gets people to start making excuses for him. if uk gets past 2nd round, people are estatic. tubby has been to one final four. he has won one final eight game. this in his entire coaching career. he is a one hit wonder. he took a georgia program that had won 20 games in the season before he got there and won 10 games in his first season. i can't believe you can't see what tubby, and yes, people like you,are doing to the program.the national media see it, and many true blue fans see it. uk is not the elite program it once was and never will be with tubby. to support him is tosupport mediocrecy.

[pdt542]

Just some stats to chew on.

A. Rupp- 17 years until won first title, 11 yeas until first final four

J. Wooden-15 yrs until won first title, 13 first final four

D. Smith- 20 yrs until first title, 14 first final four

Those are the greatest, and here are some other notables

L. Olsen-13 yrs.........Coach K-11yrs.............J. Calhoun-12 yrs.............J. Beohiem-26 yr

Roy W.-16 yrs..........Gary W......22 yrs.

Now I ask how can we complain about Tubby. Even if you take the first championship and final four away he still isn't doing bad compared to these great coaches. I wonder if there were any stupid idiots talking about running them out of town. I bet. For everyone who supports Tubby I hope this puts this nonsense to rest, but we know it won't. Hey, I wonder where the program would be if they ran Rupp out of the coaching job less than ten years after he started. These days it is much harder to get to the final four, much less win a championsip, but yet we hold them to high standards. That doesn't make much sense to me. With all of the programs that have the ability to beat you on any given night we aren't doing bad at all. We are doing GREAT. I will continue to be happy everytime UK plays weather they win or loose, because it is entertaining and I love it. Everyone on this website, including myself, probobly cares too much about UK basketball than most people think we should. Lets just not lose our heads over it like some people we know.

[CrowdControl]

xukfan wrote: always one shot, one foul, one injury, one free throw, one something. really, it is one coach. college bball is certainly different here in kentucky. louisville is surging and uk has flatlined. gonna be that way until tubby leaves. pitino takes programs in trouble and gets them to final four. tubby takes programs and gets people to start making excuses for him. if uk gets past 2nd round, people are estatic. tubby has been to one final four. he has won one final eight game. this in his entire coaching career. he is a one hit wonder. he took a georgia program that had won 20 games in the season before he got there and won 10 games in his first season. i can't believe you can't see what tubby, and yes, people like you,are doing to the program.the national media see it, and many true blue fans see it. uk is not the elite program it once was and never will be with tubby. to support him is tosupport mediocrecy.
Louisville is surging ahead? How. Lucky draw for the tourney...Dean and Garcia two experienced guards...

They lose them they lose alot. They have a talented recruiting corps but RP has alot of blending to do... I dont see them as surging ahead. moving closer maybe.

People are NOT "ecstatic" with getting past second round. We know what UK means and what we expect. The best program SHOULDNT lose in the first or second rounds, but dude, it is alot different from 1980-1990. There is parity due to the 13-limit. There is parity because the top recruits are going pro... not to other schools. So all the schools are getting the 20-70 recruits and most years... there is not THAT much difference (like this year for example)...next year it is a difference.

People expect to play hard, do all you can to win. If a team like Mich St hits like they did most of the year with their talent and coach they are in the top 10. they didnt hit stride until March. Unlucky yes. Explainable yes. A problem for UK no.

The years of 1999-2000, 2000-2001 and 2001-2002 I will give you those. Tubby made some really bad recruiting decisions and allowing Saul to attend here also was a bad decision. I will give you that. at the time it was the right decision, but hindsight has proved otherwise. Without knowing the outcome, I would do it again. I didnt say I WOULD do it again... I said not knowing I would have. KNOWING what I know, I wouldnt. hindsight is always 20/20.

It is not blackcloud and lightning and it isnt a rose garden either.

None of us have said that. YOu are the only one driven bulls--t.

[xukfan]

CrowdControl wrote: xukfan wrote: always one shot, one foul, one injury, one free throw, one something. really, it is one coach. college bball is certainly different here in kentucky. louisville is surging and uk has flatlined. gonna be that way until tubby leaves. pitino takes programs in trouble and gets them to final four. tubby takes programs and gets people to start making excuses for him. if uk gets past 2nd round, people are estatic. tubby has been to one final four. he has won one final eight game. this in his entire coaching career. he is a one hit wonder. he took a georgia program that had won 20 games in the season before he got there and won 10 games in his first season. i can't believe you can't see what tubby, and yes, people like you,are doing to the program.the national media see it, and many true blue fans see it. uk is not the elite program it once was and never will be with tubby. to support him is tosupport mediocrecy.
Louisville is surging ahead? How. Lucky draw for the tourney...Dean and Garcia two experienced guards...

They lose them they lose alot. They have a talented recruiting corps but RP has alot of blending to do... I dont see them as surging ahead. moving closer maybe.

People are NOT "ecstatic" with getting past second round. We know what UK means and what we expect. The best program SHOULDNT lose in the first or second rounds, but dude, it is alot different from 1980-1990. There is parity due to the 13-limit. There is parity because the top recruits are going pro... not to other schools. So all the schools are getting the 20-70 recruits and most years... there is not THAT much difference (like this year for example)...next year it is a difference.

People expect to play hard, do all you can to win. If a team like Mich St hits like they did most of the year with their talent and coach they are in the top 10. they didnt hit stride until March. Unlucky yes. Explainable yes. A problem for UK no.

The years of 1999-2000, 2000-2001 and 2001-2002 I will give you those. Tubby made some really bad recruiting decisions and allowing Saul to attend here also was a bad decision. I will give you that. at the time it was the right decision, but hindsight has proved otherwise. Without knowing the outcome, I would do it again. I didnt say I WOULD do it again... I said not knowing I would have. KNOWING what I know, I wouldnt. hindsight is always 20/20.

It is not blackcloud and lightning and it isnt a rose garden either.

None of us have said that. YOu are the only one driven bulls--t.

i really don't know what the shape the programs were in when all of these coaches took over their program. however, i do remember what condition the uk program was in when tubby took over. everyone is living in the past. there has been no great success past his first year here. sure, going to final eight is a good accompllishment for most program. would be for uk too if they were going to final four on occasion. but to let that be your goal should not be acceptable for the uk program. and louisville is surging when compared to uk. if you had put uk's name in louisville draw, they would not havemade the final four. i think it is kind of funny that uk get given to them a #2 seed and uofl gets a #4 seed and everyone wants to say they had easiest path. fact is, uk has been vastly overrated in seeding the past several years. they win the weak sec and that automatically gives them an unwarranted seed. they then go and show what they really are. if a move is not made soon, some coach is going to have to come into a bad situation at uk. unlike what tubby came into. not going to get pitino this time to revive the program. uk is sucking wind and mediocrecy is here with no relief in sight. by the way, here are some more stats to think about. they show the slippage. i borrowed these facts from another website. if you take away tubby's first year here, when he won with another man's players, it looks even worse.

Tubby four Elite Eights, 1 FF and one NC in eight years at UK. Pitino in six eligible years for the NCAA tourney: 5 Elite Eights, 3 FF's, one NC and one runnerup. One inherited a program with severe recruiting sanctions and NCAA ineligibility while the other inherited arguably the best team in college bball.

Elsewhere Pitino has 2 additional FF's with teams other than UK while Tubby has a couple of sweet 16's at places other than UK. Unless SEC championships are given huge weight over everything else, this contest is not even close.

Also look at head to head record. This isn't close either

[kentubbybasketball]

Who cares what anyone thinks of Tubby. pdt542 did a great job of supplying the stats, and Tubby's resume speaks for itself. Don't try to argue for Tubby. I've did it for years, and it's not worth it. (1) Tubby doesn't have to prove anything to any of us, and (2) Tubby ain't going nowhere even when those 2 little fans complain, so don't waste your time.

[pdt542]

We have never been on a plateau of success. Meaning the numbers haven't always been consistent. It is peaks and valleys. You celebrate the peaks and live through the valleys. If this is a vally it isn't a very deep one. We aren't going to get Pitino back. So forget about it. I for one would rather have Tubby. If you love Pitino so much be a Louisville fan. I have lots of friends that would help you jump on the Pitino band wagon over there. Those Tubby stats that you speak of are dreamed about by most coaches, and some are really good coaches. Do you think Roy Williams deserves the UNC job, because under your requirements he wasn't qualified. Kansas isn't too shabby of a program, and his postseason stats there were much worse that Tubby's. An elite eight isn't much of a valley. Nobody agree's with you. Like I said before, maybe you should go back to the site where you got those stats. You haven't posted anything but bad things about Tubby.

[xukfan]

pdt542 wrote: We have never been on a plateau of success. Meaning the numbers haven't always been consistent. It is peaks and valleys. You celebrate the peaks and live through the valleys. If this is a vally it isn't a very deep one. We aren't going to get Pitino back. So forget about it. I for one would rather have Tubby. If you love Pitino so much be a Louisville fan. I have lots of friends that would help you jump on the Pitino band wagon over there. Those Tubby stats that you speak of are dreamed about by most coaches, and some are really good coaches. Do you think Roy Williams deserves the UNC job, because under your requirements he wasn't qualified. Kansas isn't too shabby of a program, and his postseason stats there were much worse that Tubby's. An elite eight isn't much of a valley. Nobody agree's with you. Like I said before, maybe you should go back to the site where you got those stats. You haven't posted anything but bad things about Tubby. you are correct that i have posted mostly bad things about tubby. one reason, it is very easy to find lots of bad things to say. mostly, i would just like to get uk back to where it belongs. thank goodness pitino came back to kentucky so fans have somewhere to watch great basketball. there are many more fans against tubby than just 2. i don't believe that people should just follow in lock step with a program because they always have.. if you want greatness, sometimes you have to ask for it. most of the fans on this board would rather accept what they have over trying to make it better. i believe it is necessary to point out what is going on rather than just bury my head in the sand. no one agrees with me here because it is easier to just look the other way. they have been and are being conditioned to play follow the leader. you guys are making it easy for them. stop and really look at the program since he took over. discount the first season because no matter what you say, he has proven he had little to do with that. take a look down the road and see if this is where you want the program to be in another 5 or 10 years. i know i don't.

[wyldkatzky]

I dont think we really care what you have to say anymore xukfan.



Tubby is great, and a true classic basketball style that he adapts for the players he has. Winning championships isn't the only thing that makes a coach, hell in that case rick and tubby are tied. Granted he did inherit that team, he still had to lead them there.

Every bad thing you can say about tubby there is at least 5 things that we can think of that are good about him.

As for Tubby's recruiting, I dont see how it could be that bad. We almost had an overall number1 seed in three straight tournaments. (granted we hadn't lost to florida/sec champ and ill/unc lost and maybe a couple other losses). We've had like what? 5 SEC losses including the tournament in the last 3 seasons and you say this guy can't coach? It takes a lot to win at florida, tenessee, alabama, arkansas etc.



Uk's biggest problem losing games the last few years hasn't been tubby, its been shooting the ball and turnovers. Tubby can coach a style that limits turnovers, but he can't control how the players shoot the ball.

[xukfan]

wyldkatzky wrote: I dont think we really care what you have to say anymore xukfan.



Tubby is great, and a true classic basketball style that he adapts for the players he has. Winning championships isn't the only thing that makes a coach, hell in that case rick and tubby are tied. Granted he did inherit that team, he still had to lead them there.

Every bad thing you can say about tubby there is at least 5 things that we can think of that are good about him.

As for Tubby's recruiting, I dont see how it could be that bad. We almost had an overall number1 seed in three straight tournaments. (granted we hadn't lost to florida/sec champ and ill/unc lost and maybe a couple other losses). We've had like what? 5 SEC losses including the tournament in the last 3 seasons and you say this guy can't coach? It takes a lot to win at florida, tenessee, alabama, arkansas etc.



Uk's biggest problem losing games the last few years hasn't been tubby, its been shooting the ball and turnovers. Tubby can coach a style that limits turnovers, but he can't control how the players shoot the ball.

i'm not sure tubby led the 98 team anywhere. he certainly didn't lead the georgia team anywhere in the first year there. as far as tubby not being responsible for shooting and turnovers, that 's why he is supposed to be the coach. if it only happened sporatically, you might have a weak case. however, it has be prevailent throughout his coaching career. his only goal is to teach pushing and shoving defense. he has hung his hat there and that is the way he will always do it. he doesn't care what the fans want. if you don't believe me about how much he cares for your opinion, just get on his talk show sometime and ask him. he will tell you he is going to do what he thinks is best. to him 50 and 60 point games are great. as for them getting great seeds in the tournment, they get that by winning the sec. however, everyone knows the sec has been very weak for the last 4 years and counting. someday the selection comm. is going to remember that and rank the teams accordingly. unfortunately, they still would like to have uk in finals just to sell tickets and for viewership. not because of what uk had done recently, but because of the past success. tubby's leadership is going to start costing uk in near future. write it down.

[WildcatDan]

i'm not sure tubby led the 98 team anywhere.


The players on the 98 team gave Tubby the credit. I think it was Padgett that said they were falling apart until they bought into Tubby's system.

[xukfan]

would you really expect them to say anything else in public. there was some grumbling by the players. cameron mills was very reluctant to say anything glowing about tubby until recently. however, he seems to want to be on the radio more, so that is probably why he has been more praising of tubby. assuming that the 98 teamdid buy into the system, and not immediantly, he would have had a relatively short time to implement his system. kind of hard to get a whole new system in place in a year, much less in month or two. i believe that tubby has proven in the past 7 years what his system is all about. not much fun to watch and would not be preceived as very successful if sec was not so weak. he has and probably will continue to fail to get to final four. i do believe it to be possible if he get very lucky and if the selection comm. continues to give them those unwarranted high seeds. however, he will never get uk another championship... when he is gone, hopefully sooner rather than later, and everyone looks back on his effects on the program, it will be recognized as missed opportunities that uk would have had ifhe were not the coach. i realize that this upsets a lot of people who want to support the uk program. sometimes is it necessary to sprinkle a little truth in with the grand standing. fans get confused sometimes when it comes to supporting their team. a real fan want what is best, the greater good, if you will. no one can truely say that the tubby regime has be a resounding success. he is like an assistant coach who has to replace the head coach temporarely for some reason. he may not be as good as the head man, he just tries to maintain until the big guy gets back. no one would really want to say in another 5 years that uk had maybe been to a final eight as the only mark of success. it is going to happen if he stays. i realize that my complaints will not make a difference of him staying or going. however, i can't just sit back and listen to all the propaganda about what a great coach he is, when is simply is not true. uk will be much better when he is gone.

[WildcatDan]

You are certainly entitled to your opinion even though you are wrong. ;)

Not to be picky or anything, but when you make an enormous post like that it is easier to read if you would break it up a little bit.

[pdt542]

he is entitled to his own opinion, even if it is the opinion of an uneducated little kid.

[xukfan]

pdt542 wrote: he is entitled to his own opinion, even if it is the opinion of an uneducated little kid.i have noticed that when people cannot prove a point or they have a weak case, they generally revert to name calling. you are good at that, at least. i leave you with this thought, if you had known when pitino had left that the next coach you hired would, after the first year of being given the greatest program in college bball and a great team, would you have hired that coach if you knew that he would not be able to take the program back to a final four, much less win a championship, in over seven years, and maybe more??? surely, you would not. my point, it is good that you support the program. just don't fall into the trap of lowering your expectations so you can feel good after you are disappointed year after year. as a supporter of uk, you should demand more than what you have gotten. tubby, the coach has done the best he can, you now see what you have, do you want it to continue for years to come. see ya.

[matt57]

personally xukfan, i find it offensive that your actually claiming we are supporting a mediocre program......no one takes basketball more serious then us uk fans.....you are a self proclaimed "xukfan".....let's leave it that way....i will continue to support MY team with all my might....i will continue to be on cloud 9 after every win and ready to cry after every season is over and we say goodbye to a senior class.....you can continue to shoot down everything you like.....uk has no place for fairweather fans, that is UL's fan base not ours......therefore just by reading what you have been posting i can tell you are not a diehard fan like the rest of us here.....while we're talking about recruiting, who will step up next year, what our lineup may look like, and so on. all you can do is whine about our program and how we haven't been to a final four in seven years....which i remind you no one knows that fact any better than us DIEHARD fans who hang on every shot of the season....no one wants to be @ a final four more than my fellow posters here....personally i feel your comments are simply absurd....i feel your handle should be changed from xukfan to rpfan.....i ask you where were you during the sutton era???? during probation???? i'm only 23 and i have forgotten more about OUR beautiful program then you will ever know......you are far from a "true fan" the ones of us who support our program through thick and then are the one's who deserve to root for a program has illustrious as uk....i promise i will not read another one of your posts regarding the stae of our program and take it seriously.....UL is coming off of a final four i think you are needed there

[pdt542]

huruph matt57. Very well said. Screw this guy. He is taking for granted the Greatest program in College basketball.EDIT Don't bite the hand that feeds you. You don't have anyting to say but to bash tubby. Nobody likes you here.EDIT Go root for another program. I'll be laughing all the way to our national title in the next couple of years. Coach K is taking applications, and I can give you the address.

Take it easy now. I know you don't like him but we don't need all of that. - Dan

[WildcatBlue2123]

Neo Zeo wrote: Why do a lot of people feel there is a media bias against Kentucky basketball? I don't get it. Clearly there is a media lovefest with Duke, but I have yet to see anything anti-UK. If anything, they favor UK. It gets really tiring everytime Dicky V drools over the fact that Ashley Judd is at a game. Well, If Kentucky has three McDonbald's All Americans on the team, along with Ramel Bradley, Patrick Sparks, and three seven footers, you would EXPECT to be in the top four or five. Right? Well, when analysists are still leaving out UK in the top four or five, well, you might think that there a little biased, or maybe we're a HAS been or something. Duke has been all over the media since the new millenium, and NC will always be all over the media because they are NC. Well, you would think that since we're Kentucky, the nations all time winningest program, you would think the SPECIALISTS would astleast give us SOME respect by noticing our talent and our coach. and Heck, look at the name on the jersey. Enough Said.

[pdt542]

If Morris comes back I'm pretty sure we are a lock for a top five spot. I think Espn probobly would have had us next on that list. One thing that you have to remember is that UNC is coming off a national championship and that is why they were on that list. Not because of who they have coming back, but just because they won the title. I don't think that ANY of their analysts have them in the top five or ten for that matter. I'm not worried about being in that poll in april or may. We will be there in November as long as Randolf comes back and no significant injuries happen.

[CrowdControl]

xukfan wrote: pdt542 wrote: he is entitled to his own opinion, even if it is the opinion of an uneducated little kid.i have noticed that when people cannot prove a point or they have a weak case, they generally revert to name calling. you are good at that, at least. i leave you with this thought, if you had known when pitino had left that the next coach you hired would, after the first year of being given the greatest program in college bball and a great team, would you have hired that coach if you knew that he would not be able to take the program back to a final four, much less win a championship, in over seven years, and maybe more??? surely, you would not. my point, it is good that you support the program. just don't fall into the trap of lowering your expectations so you can feel good after you are disappointed year after year. as a supporter of uk, you should demand more than what you have gotten. tubby, the coach has done the best he can, you now see what you have, do you want it to continue for years to come. see ya.
most of the time people dont respond to falsehoods like yours... but then again, your paradigm is so narrow. There is no margin for any error.

Very limited dude. Get out and smell the hossa.

[wildcatfanman3pt]

xukfan wrote: pdt542 wrote: he is entitled to his own opinion, even if it is the opinion of an uneducated little kid.i have noticed that when people cannot prove a point or they have a weak case, they generally revert to name calling. you are good at that, at least. i leave you with this thought, if you had known when pitino had left that the next coach you hired would, after the first year of being given the greatest program in college bball and a great team, would you have hired that coach if you knew that he would not be able to take the program back to a final four, much less win a championship, in over seven years, and maybe more??? surely, you would not. my point, it is good that you support the program. just don't fall into the trap of lowering your expectations so you can feel good after you are disappointed year after year. as a supporter of uk, you should demand more than what you have gotten. tubby, the coach has done the best he can, you now see what you have, do you want it to continue for years to come. see ya.


I really don't understand some cat fans. Why knock on Tubby right now? Fact of the matter is that you can't do anything about it. He's are coach like it or not. And it makes his job harder with all u cat fans that knock him. He's a great coach, One of the best in College Basketball. Like him or not, he's our coach. Get over it.

[CrowdControl]

Good luck getting him away from East Lansing.

[wildcatfanman3pt]

Tom Izzo has a lot of respect for Tubby and Kentucky. I agree with CC on this one though. Tom Izzo has been at Mich St. so long and has basicly established a home there. I doubt Tomm would come to Kentucky if offered, not becuase of te job, but because of loyalty and just loving it at Michagain St. If someone were to replace him, i'd be looking at a few coaches. One is Illinoise. Bruce Webber hasn't been there long at Illinoise and i'm sure with losing a lot of players he would really consider Kentucky. Another might be the OU coach. But for now Tubby is our coach. (that statement wasn't suppose to sound bad). Tubby is one of the best coaches in the Nation. Like it or not he's are coach, and for all tubby bashers out there, your just going to have to live with it.

[pdt542]

I'm glad you said that. I love Tubby, but if it came down to it Izzo would be the guy that I wanted. You never know, but it would be hard. Tubby is number 1 though.