Darius Miller

[wildcatcrazy]

Most won't know anything about this kid--just a sophomore for Mason County--and I'll admit a bad taste in my mouth from the Chris Lofton deal.

That said, I just don't get this staff. This kid is 6'6' and growing, can handle the ball and shoot it and is a GREAT kid from a GREAT family. On top of that Mason County is only 60 miles from UK, yet UK hasn't sent anyone to see him yet.

I'm not saying we chase every sophomore in the country but it doesn't make sense to me that UK doesn't have a clue about this kid. He has a chance to be a terrific player--and kids know if an assistant coach is in the gym.

Once again--I believe Tubby and the staff are not putting out the effort---all they would have to do is attend a couple of games per year (Reggie Hanson knows where Mason County is!) and at least keep UK in the hunt. (He is already getting D-1 interest from Xavier so he is no slouch.)

Just plain lack of effort from where I sit--or worse than that-- arrogance.

[Aike]

OT, but do you know anything about about a cousin of Chris Lofton who is only in eighth grade, but is already like 6'6"? I think his name is Steve. Thanks.

[Mark Blueblood]

How do you know that UK's coaching staff knows nothing about this kid??

Also, keep in mind, they can't, especially in basketball season, watch ever 15 year old kid that has D1 promise. I'm sure they're aware of him and he might even be on their radar.

Chill out man - they know what they're doing.

[wildcatcrazy]

Mark,

We'll agree to disagree.

Maysville is 60 miles from Lexington so I'm not suggesting they watch every 15 year old kid in the country--just those that are within 60 miles, 6'6' and growning, can handle the ball, from a great family and from an area that is huge UK territory. Not too much to ask Reggie Hanson to grab a burger and come to Maysville a couple of times per year to watch him play.

"They know what they are doing"--I'll leave that one alone

[UedK]

But back to Markb's first question, How do you know UK has not been in contact?

[wildcatcrazy]

I'm not talking "contact", I'm talking coming to see the kid play. Believe me, he has a chance at being a high D-1 player---and there is NO EXCUSE IMO that Coach Smith can't send an assistant coach 60 miles a couple of times to watch him play.

The fact is this staff, for whatever reason, isn't getting it done in recruting in my opinion and this kid is just a very small part of that fact. This young many may never play D-1 basketball--but he has already visited Xavier--and UK sends a brochure? Not quite the same thing.

All I am sayiing is show interest early--as they did NOT do on Lofton--and then follow the young mans progress. For gooness sake, we've given Williams and Porter scholarships in their JUNIOR years and they are likely career marginal players.

Why would we not come see the kid play? I have no answer for that other than being unaware, being lazy or being arrogant. None may be true but none are acceptable IMO.

[I. Melvin]

Based on performance, the burden of proof seems to be on this staff, imo.

Mark, I'm sure you remember Joe B.'s famous line to his assistants, "No more damn Jeff Hall's". Same reasoning should apply here.

[BowlingGreenUKGrad]

Melvin,

Enlighten the us younger members that don't know the quote you're referring to.

Oh, and after seeing Miller play in the Sweet 16 - he is someone Tubby and staff should be showing interest in.

[catfanintn]

I. Melvin wrote: Based on performance, the burden of proof seems to be on this staff, imo.

Mark, I'm sure you remember Joe B.'s famous line to his assistants, "No more damn Jeff Hall's". Same reasoning should apply here.




Good analogy. You don't know you're getting a "Jeff Hall" unless you see him play, do you? Who knows what strategy Tubby and his staff use, but wildcatcrazy is right on here. Mason Co. being an hour drive away, sounds pretty simple to me to drive up and show some interest in case he does blossom.

[wildcatcrazy]

Thanks guys.

I am more than biased as I'm a Mason County fan but Deron Feldhaus still lives here so it is not asking too much to have Reggie Hanson come visit his old friend and take in a couple of Mason County games next year (we wasted that opportunity this year IMO).

I'm not saying offer him a scholarship. I'm not sayiing he will be a high D-1 talent. I am saying he has great potential and is a great kid--and is still growing (6'6" now), can handle the ball OK and shoot it OK. I'd say that is worth a couple of hours of staff time!

BTW, someone earlier asked about a Lofton "cousin" that was 6'6". I can only presume they were talkiing about Miller--and they are not related.

[I. Melvin]

Jeff Hall was a combo guard from Kentucky (can't remember where) that UK spurned. He signed with UofL and bedeviled us his entire career.

After one such outing, Joe B. told his assistants he wanted "no more damn Jeff Halls", meaning that the recruiting staff better not leave local stones unturned while jet-setting to California.

[wildcatcrazy]

Jeff Hall was from the Ashland area.

Also, as an aside, I'm not one of those "sign more Kentucky boys" people. We need GREAT players with GREAT attitudes--and I don't care where they are from!

That said, all things being equal, take the Kentucky boy as the name on the jersey will mean more IMO.

[Aike]

One of Chris Lofton's cousins told me last summer that they had another cousin (or nephew, I don't remember) who was in the eighth grade and already around 6'6" with a large frame. He said that the kid was the size of a football player, but only played basketball. I thought he said his name was Stevie, but I'm not sure. For that matter, I'm not sure if he was from Mason County or maybe from a surrounding county. Beyond that, he might have been pulling my leg. :cool: The more time that passes without anybody knowing who this kid is, the more I am going to go with the pulling my leg theory. Any takers?

wildcatcrazy wrote: Thanks guys.

I am more than biased as I'm a Mason County fan but Deron Feldhaus still lives here so it is not asking too much to have Reggie Hanson come visit his old friend and take in a couple of Mason County games next year (we wasted that opportunity this year IMO).

I'm not saying offer him a scholarship. I'm not sayiing he will be a high D-1 talent. I am saying he has great potential and is a great kid--and is still growing (6'6" now), can handle the ball OK and shoot it OK. I'd say that is worth a couple of hours of staff time!

BTW, someone earlier asked about a Lofton "cousin" that was 6'6". I can only presume they were talkiing about Miller--and they are not related.

[T75]

wildcatcrazy wrote:
I'm not saying we chase every sophomore in the country but it doesn't make sense to me that UK doesn't have a clue about this kid. He has a chance to be a terrific player--and kids know if an assistant coach is in the gym.

Once again--I believe Tubby and the staff are not putting out the effort---all they would have to do is attend a couple of games per year (Reggie Hanson knows where Mason County is!) and at least keep UK in the hunt. (He is already getting D-1 interest from Xavier so he is no slouch.)

Just plain lack of effort from where I sit--or worse than that-- arrogance.

Tubby and the UK people know that they can get lots of blue-blooded Ky kids no matter how they treat them in the recruiting period---Patrick for example, or Ravi, or Carter. They didn't even give Carter the time of day until some name schools started recruiting him. I don't like the way they treat Ky kids either.

I know we can't get by with only Ky kids, but we could surely do better with a few more of them who can play---at least they care!

[wildcatcrazy]

The fact that this kid is from Kentucky has nothing to do with it IMO. GEOGRAPHICALLY, it is an easy hour drive from Lexington to Maysville and there is no excuse not to be all over this kid.

Will he turn out to be a high D-1 talent? I have no clue but the skills are there. he is 6'6" as a sophomore, long-lean body with much growning to do, can handle the ball and shoot it, can jump and comes from a great tradition of winning at Mason County and is from a great family.

Am I missing something? Why wouldn't UK have watched this kid play yet? Believe me, the "We are Kentucky and we can come in at the last minute" doesn't work too well any more--especially in Mason County with the Lofton deal.

I seriouslly question this staff's work ethic when it comes to recruiting. If not work ethic, I question their process.

[sardiscat]

"Chill out man - they know what they're doing."

The results of the past five years' recruiting strongly suggests they don't exactly know what they're doing.

[wildcatcrazy]

Sardis,

I reluctanly agree. If I'm Tubby, I'd find a way to ramp up my recruiting 10 fold--and that includes recruitinig a talented kid 60 miles away!

[NYCat]

There are some serious assumptions in your statement. One, you have no idea what level of contact Tubby has have with this kid. Two, are you a scout? Can you honestly say that you are a good judge of college level talent? Because the guru's dont even get it right alot of the time. Do you know FOR A FACT that "he has growing to do"... or "he can handle the ball and shoot it" against decent competition?

Third, for every Lofton there are 2 Carrier's and Hiesenbuttle's. We are NOT Michigan State, we do NOT have our own Flint or Detroit. We do NOT have the high school breeding ground that alot of states benefit from. We did get Rondo, who has been the only McD from the state in how long????

It just sounds like youve seen some kid play that impressed you, and you think that we shouldve signed him already (as a sophmore) or something. Sorry, I just dont share your outlook.

wildcatcrazy wrote: The fact that this kid is from Kentucky has nothing to do with it IMO. GEOGRAPHICALLY, it is an easy hour drive from Lexington to Maysville and there is no excuse not to be all over this kid.

Will he turn out to be a high D-1 talent? I have no clue but the skills are there. he is 6'6" as a sophomore, long-lean body with much growning to do, can handle the ball and shoot it, can jump and comes from a great tradition of winning at Mason County and is from a great family.

Am I missing something? Why wouldn't UK have watched this kid play yet? Believe me, the "We are Kentucky and we can come in at the last minute" doesn't work too well any more--especially in Mason County with the Lofton deal.

I seriouslly question this staff's work ethic when it comes to recruiting. If not work ethic, I question their process.

[wildcatcrazy]

NYCat,

No assumptions--just fact--I went to every game at Mason County and no UK coach showed up to watch him play.

Second--no I'm not a scout but I can tell when a kid is 6'6", agile, good handle, shoots it well, works hard and comes from a great family. Don't need to be a scout to see that this kid may turn out to be a great player.

I know for a fact he can do all those things--I've been him play 50 basketball games and watched him through AAU. As far as growning, I obviously have no crystall ball but his build suggests that he can handle more weight and his Dad's build suggest he will grow. Is that enough insight?

From your handle, can I assume you are from New York or live in New York now? If so, just trust me on this one. This kid MAY turn out to be a player and the UK staff has done a terrible job IMO in recruiting the past several years and IMO there is no acceptable excuse for not watching this kid play this year--an hour away.

Also, review my posts. I never said anythiing about offering the kid a scholarship.

Bottom line, I'm using this young man--whom I know well and have watched him play dozens of times-as an example of how out of touch I think Tubby and his staff are in recruiting in general--not just in Kentucky. This has nothing to do with Lofton on Heisenbuttal or the kid being from Kentukcy for that matter. This is about what I am afraid is arrogance on this Kentucky staff that indicates "we can wait until the last minute and get the Kentucky kids".

I hate to be so direct but I honestly don't post as fact when it is an opinion. My OPINION is that UK is again doing a terrible job recruiting a Maysville kid. The FACT is that this kid is a sophomore and with his talent, work ethic and family, COULD turn out to be a great player--and UK has not been to watch him play.

[Coldstream]

wildcatcrazy wrote: NYCat,

No assumptions--just fact--I went to every game at Mason County and no UK coach showed up to watch him play.

Second--no I'm not a scout but I can tell when a kid is 6'6", agile, good handle, shoots it well, works hard and comes from a great family. Don't need to be a scout to see that this kid may turn out to be a great player.

I know for a fact he can do all those things--I've been him play 50 basketball games and watched him through AAU. As far as growning, I obviously have no crystall ball but his build suggests that he can handle more weight and his Dad's build suggest he will grow. Is that enough insight?

From your handle, can I assume you are from New York or live in New York now? If so, just trust me on this one. This kid MAY turn out to be a player and the UK staff has done a terrible job IMO in recruiting the past several years and IMO there is no acceptable excuse for not watching this kid play this year--an hour away.

Also, review my posts. I never said anythiing about offering the kid a scholarship.

Bottom line, I'm using this young man--whom I know well and have watched him play dozens of times-as an example of how out of touch I think Tubby and his staff are in recruiting in general--not just in Kentucky. This has nothing to do with Lofton on Heisenbuttal or the kid being from Kentukcy for that matter. This is about what I am afraid is arrogance on this Kentucky staff that indicates "we can wait until the last minute and get the Kentucky kids".

I hate to be so direct but I honestly don't post as fact when it is an opinion. My OPINION is that UK is again doing a terrible job recruiting a Maysville kid. The FACT is that this kid is a sophomore and with his talent, work ethic and family, COULD turn out to be a great player--and UK has not been to watch him play.


I can agree to certain extent that the recruiting hasn't been up to par with this staff lately. But to insinuate that UK's recruitment (or lack thereof) of Miller is any indication to their recruiting process is not good analogy. This kid is NR and Lofton was a 3 star. Something has to indicate why the kid isn't rated in the basketball database especially since he was in AAU basketball leagues where he would surely be seen by scouts.

To give an example here from my own experience, Jeremy Simpson in HS FB shattered the state record for TDs in a season. Was a monster RB on the field, played in the All-Star game as well. Ended up at WKU but fizzled there. So he was producing ridiculous statistics and breaking records but he didn't dominate the college scene at all.

[NYCat]

Fair enough crazy...

Your point was to illustrate the fact that you are not happy with Tubby's recruiting using Darius as an example.

My point was to illustrate the fact that there are hundreds of stories like Darius' every year. It sounds like Darius is a talent... but maybe Tubby feels like he has been burned with instate recruiting too often. I dont know, but Im not the one second guessing him and making presumptions that he or his staff is lazy.

My personal opinion... sounds like he shouldve contacted this kid or sent someone to see him play. But my job is to develop software, not to run a college basketball team. On a side note, Im from Kentucky, but live in NYC. I dont get to see a lot of high school hoops up here, so all my info comes from reading the message boards and recruiting pages.

[Will Lavender]

NYCat wrote: My point was to illustrate the fact that there are hundreds of stories like Darius' every year. It sounds like Darius is a talent... but maybe Tubby feels like he has been burned with instate recruiting too often. I dont know, but Im not the one second guessing him and making presumptions that he or his staff is lazy.

For example:

My grandfather doesn't like Tubby Smith because Tubby didn't recruit my cousin.

My cousin is a 6'5" power forward who's now playing at Union College.

True story.

We can all agree that recruiting needs to change. The extent of that change, of course, is debatable. But to use a local kid who is not rated as an example of the staff's "arrogance"? Well, to me that's a little much.

[wildcatcrazy]

Guys,

I don't much care that the kid isn't rated. I'm simply hanging my hate on the fact that the kid could develope into a special player and is only 60 miles away and worth a vist to watch him play. No more--no less--just show a reasonable amount of interest in case the kid ends up being a player.

I realize that suggesting the staff is lazy or arrogant is a stretch. It may well have to do with the recruiting process or something other than these negative terms. All I am working on is recruiting results--which I think have been very poor on average given the status of UK basketball--and on the fact that this kid deserves a look.

Said another way, how many other kids are 6'6" with his skills and a sophomore that live within an hours drive of Lexington. Not many--if any--and by the way he is also a good student.

Just using facts in this case to make a point about recruiting--sorry if I crossed the line on the arrogant or lazy assumptions.

[Mark Blueblood]

wildcatcrazy - I'm well familiar with the proximity of Maysville to Lexington - and to Newport, for that matter. My wife and I were in Maysville Saturday. Did a little shopping at Kroger's.

I'm only saying that we have no idea if this kid is on Tubby's radar or not.

And...he is just a sophomore. Trust me - if he's that good - Tubby will know about it.

[beeballerbluegrchs]

A kid I know lives near Lex and is great, and has potential to play at a top tier school, but UK hasn't sent anyone to look at him. :rolleyes:

[wildcatcrazy]

Mark,

Fair enough--but knowing about him and staying in contact and watching him play can be different things--especially in a 15 year old kids mind.

Its one thing to get a nice glossy item in the mail-but quite another to get a phone call or have an assistant come watch him play. Please understand this is just an example of the type of thing that this staff drops the ball on IMO.

I am NOT saying that Darius should be offered a scholarship at age 15--we have done that with Williams and now Porter after their Junior years and the jury is still out on that strategy. I am saying that Tubby and the staff need to ramp up their recruiting efforts---in every way, shape and form.

Hope you had a nice visit to Maysville.

[RCS]

Only the very top Sophmores get recruited, and I mean very top. Most coaches are not on kids until their JR years. Tubby has been a little late even at that. IMO and may be one of his problems but that is a seperate issue. If this kid turns into a player as a JR and SR and Tubby still shows no love, I think you have a point. To say it is a problem that we are not recruiting a Sophmore that is not in the top 100 is a bit of a stretch. Nomajor school isrecruiting unranked Sophmores. Thereare just too many and there are too many things that can happen before this kid steps foot on UK campus. It sounds like a guy to keep an eye on but it is a bit early to start worring about UK recruting him.

[wildcatcrazy]

RCS,

You call it a stretch--I call it covering our bases and spending a nice evening watching basketball in Maysville. NO WAY those guys are that busy that they can't visit a potential recruit an hour away.

Bottom line, this has nothing to do with Darius--he is just an example of what I believe to be poor recruiting practices by this staff. With all due respect, if we were getting the players we should be getting, we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

There are NOT too many recruits with his potential within 60 miles---and using the fact that he is not "rated" in the top 100-when he is only an hour away--makes no sense IMO. Lofton wasn't in the top 100 either and, had we given him any attention, we could have at least had a shot. (I'm not revisiitiing that recruitment, just making a point.)

If this staff continues to do things the same way--or as others do them--we'll continue to get the results we are getting--which isn't nearly good enough IMO. Whats wrong with outsmarting and outworking the other guy?

[coachsd04]

Wildcatcrazy-I am certain Darius Miller is getting his dues from UK. Darius Miller is still developing and his footwork must get better in order to be an elite recruit. I have watched him play AAU and in high school games, he is progressing.

[wildcatcrazy]

Coach,

Sounds like you at least agree that he COULD turn into an Elite player--I personally could give a hoot what the rankings say. I can see a 6'6" body the is still growing and a great frame to put on weight and enough talent to be interested.

All I am saying is that a UK assistant should have watched him play a couple of times this past year and this next year--and that Tubby should call or visit in the next year to guage interest.

I certainly understand that Darius has a lot of work to do to become and elite player--for example, he has to become more "selfish" with the game on the line and take over games. He doesn't often do that yet--but the potential is there and he is, as was Lofton, in Tubby's back yard.

[coachsd04]

I like your post, but would not necessarily say become more selfish. True, Miller needs to become a "gamer" but he has to work on his overall skills (agilities) to get to that level where he can "take over." For Miller, this summer will be important to his development. If he trainsand works out and does NOT just rely on AAU to get better, his game should get to the level it needs to be in order to be a D1 recruit and a recruit for UK.

[wildcatcrazy]

Coach,

I totally agree. He is a pretty laid-back kid and if he can get serious in the weight room this summer, get stronger and work on specific skills on his own--he does have the potential to be special.

He has several great things going for him other than the obvious talent:

1) He is a terrific kid

2) Comes from a strong Christian family

3) Plays at Mason County where there is some expectation of improving during the summer and he should get good coaching.

Bottom line--as far as I am concerned--is that the kid has a shot and----in case that shot deveops into a D-1 talent--Tubby should be at least on this kids radar screen and deserves a visit. Often, the one that recruits the longest wins--and he has already been contacted by Xavier.

Thanks for the assessment-we obviously agree that he has much work to do but could develop into a very, very good player.