Cats' Sims might transfer, JUCO coach says

[ukbob]

By Jerry Tipton
HERALD-LEADER STAFF WRITER
Rekalin Sims, the player brought in last year to ease the loss of Chuck Hayes, might be leaving Kentucky.

Sims plans to travel to Salt Lake City this weekend to discuss his basketball future with his junior college coaches. Norm Parrish, who coached Sims at Salt Lake Community College, said he wasn't sure whether his former player wanted to stay at UK.

"If he's going to stay there, I think he'd want a little pep talk," Parrish said last night. "His confidence went down. If he's going to leave, I'm sure he'd ask us to have a hand in it."

Frank Allocco, who coached Sims at De La Salle High in Vallejo, Calif., said he had been contacted by more than one coach asking whether Sims might be available.

http://www.kentucky.com/mld/kentucky/sports/14210582.htm

[Lost Highway]

FCFS82 wrote: Alright, maybe I am reading this the wrong way, or maybe I am in a foul mood today, but at least how that blurb reads I have one reaction:

Sign the release form.

You earna starting job/more PT, you don't cherry pick a position that is weak.

Good luck to him, but let him go. I would rather see someone that wants to work hard and improve their game. Otherwise, what is the reason of airing the laundry in the press?

Frustration is starting to bubble.

:thumbdown





Didn't some UK posters on this forum predict a couple of weeks ago that there may be players who are considering moving on? I admit I didn't think Sims would be in this group (not with only one more year eligibility) so I am surprised his name is being mentioned. Now I wonder if Tubby will try to persuade him to hang around the program one more year.

Tubby said on his show there would be changes. He also mentioned Sims was getting fat. (well he said it in a nicer, kinder, gentler way) but the message was he had a weight problem.

So if Sims leaves, are there any "Corey Brewers" out there who want to play for Tubby's Cats?

[flacat22]

If thats the case then so be it, good luck at our next stop (for 1 year). Kentucky didnt cause the back injury and his lack of skills (in comparison to Morris') or drive to improve isnt Tubby's fault either. Hate to see anyone leave given the current state of the team but I dont think his departure would be as devastating as if other current Cats left.

[sardiscat]

What will be will be, but I'd hate to see Sims leave. I was as perplexed as he is about why he didn't get more playing time last season. The way UK got demolished inside game after game, I thought one solution might be a front line of Sims, Perry, and Morris. Instead, Tubby never played more than two front line players at a time, and most of the time when Sims was on the floor, he was playing the five, which is certainly not his best position. Player attitudes may have been a big problem last year, but so was Tubby's stubborn refusal to put a Division 1 sized team on the floor. Doesn't matter how many players leave, if next year'sfront line next yearis 6'4", 6'6", and 6'8" again, the problems of this year are not going to have been solved.

[Art Vandelay]

Sims is just the most recent in a long line of players that have either transferred or considered transferring out of Tubby's program. I'm sure there will be several to jump in and tell me how wrong I am, but it seems that Tubby has far too many disaffected players and far too many kids leaving the team early.

[golflender]

not to try to spin this but ---maybe the players are leaving that Tubby wants to leave, if Sims leaving makes room for a Tyler Smith, then I am all for it.

[Cat Country]

golflender wrote: not to try to spin this but ---maybe the players are leaving that Tubby wants to leave, if Sims leaving makes room for a Tyler Smith, then I am all for it.


I'm with you golflender!! I liked Sims, but this teams needs an overhaul, and if Sims and Williams transfers, lets sign Phil Jones and Tyler Smith, I want to believe that is why they've yet to commit anywhere. I hope they are wanting a spot on our roster. But like I said earlier, I liked Rekalin Sims and would wish him the best if he should leave.

[SCBlu]

Sims' possible/probable departure magnifies the team's desperate need for a meaningful presence at power forward. It's just incredible-- and an indictment of our recruiting "prowess"-- that we are where we are. Unbelievable!

[Houstoncat]

Theres some info going around saying Tyler Smith is now considering Pittsburg due to rumors swirling around TS, The Program, and TS going leaving.

The Coach and Administration need to make definitive statements one way or the other. What recruiting we have going on currently is going to take a hit unless some of these issues whether rumor or not are resolved.

[WildcatDan]

Sims looked really stiff most of the time he was on the floor in the later part of the year and you could really tell that his back was bothering him. He would not go for loose balls on the floor and a lot of times it seemed like a long rebound that would come out near him would just be looked at as it went past. I hardly see how it is Tubby's fault that he could not play to his potential.

[wildcat74]

flacat22 wrote: If thats the case then so be it, good luck at our next stop (for 1 year). Kentucky didnt cause the back injury and his lack of skills (in comparison to Morris') or drive to improve isnt Tubby's fault either. Hate to see anyone leave given the current state of the team but I dont think his departure would be as devastating as if other current Cats left.



He may not have morris' talent, but he surely has more than sheray. IMO, the minutes for these 2 should have been reversed this year.

[golflender]

wildcat74 wrote: flacat22 wrote: If thats the case then so be it, good luck at our next stop (for 1 year). Kentucky didnt cause the back injury and his lack of skills (in comparison to Morris') or drive to improve isnt Tubby's fault either. Hate to see anyone leave given the current state of the team but I dont think his departure would be as devastating as if other current Cats left.



He may not have morris' talent, but he surely has more than sheray. IMO, the minutes for these 2 should have been reversed this year.


jmo but Thomas played better than Sims did this year. (after Sims back problems)

[VIIBanners]

You guys would turn on your own mothers. You have no idea what is behind his motivations arefor leaving. It seems that most of you are willing to pounce on any of these guys for any reason... and are content to construct your own scenarios to rationalize being ugly toward our players. I just don't get it.

[WildcatDan]

I actually felt bad for Sims because I could tell he was frustrated with his playing time and performance... but I guess I was wrong to assume that he was actually frustrated at the injury... that was the point that I was trying to make... he was GETTING the minutes before he hurt his back, and then couldn't seem to play with the same intensity afterwards.

I DO hope he comes back and gets over the injury so he can play to his potential next year.

[VIIBanners]

I was mostly speaking to Flacat. He preaches but doesn't practice.

[RaleighCat]

I wish every party in this situation the best outcome possible. It that's with Sims moving on, then so be it. If that's with Sims staying and getting back to 100%- and competing for playing time, then so be it.

I will use this situation to point out that having a team full of role players (ie, NON-McD's AA) can still lead to some ego/defection problems. It's ironic that we're discussing Sims' potential departure at the same time UNC fans are discussing Tyler Hansbrough's potential departure. UNC's first year pf is a super-hyped McD's AA who makes 3rd team All American/first team All ACC/Rookie of the Year. Our first year pf is a juco with solid (but not spectacular) pedigree who gave us very little overall.

Sometimes the headaches and heartaches that come with McD's AA and early-defections can be worth it. Sometimes you get them no matter what.

[golflender]

this brings up a good point for discussion, should Tubby run his program like a business, ie,if you don't produce then your gone, or would yourather he remain loyal to some players who have no business playing for UK, (even though bad recruiting brought them here) I think the pressure is on Smith for his past mistakes and he is doing what he needs to do, to bring KY basketball back to where it should be.

[wildcat74]

golflender wrote: this brings up a good point for discussion, should Tubby run his program like a business, ie,if you don't produce then your gone, or would yourather he remain loyal to some players who have no business playing for UK, (even though bad recruiting brought them here) I think the pressure is on Smith for his past mistakes and he is doing what he needs to do, to bring KY basketball back to where it should be.


"If you dont producethen your gone" would set a bad precidence and would be unacceptable. Either dont play them, or better yet dont recruit them from the begining (ie, woo, shag, thomas, williams)

[golflender]

wildcat74 wrote:
"If you dont producethen your gone" would set a bad precidence and would be unacceptable. Either dont play them, or better yet dont recruit them from the begining (ie, woo, shag, thomas, williams)



thats my point bad recruiting decisions, if you make a bad hire in a business would you not fire them or at least find some way to push them out the door to make room for someone better qualified. (and again Tubby created his own problems)

[Buddah]

Lost Highway wrote: FCFS82 wrote: Alright, maybe I am reading this the wrong way, or maybe I am in a foul mood today, but at least how that blurb reads I have one reaction:

Sign the release form.

You earna starting job/more PT, you don't cherry pick a position that is weak.

Good luck to him, but let him go. I would rather see someone that wants to work hard and improve their game. Otherwise, what is the reason of airing the laundry in the press?

Frustration is starting to bubble.

:thumbdown





Didn't some UK posters on this forum predict a couple of weeks ago that there may be players who are considering moving on? I admit I didn't think Sims would be in this group (not with only one more year eligibility) so I am surprised his name is being mentioned. Now I wonder if Tubby will try to persuade him to hang around the program one more year.

Tubby said on his show there would be changes. He also mentioned Sims was getting fat. (well he said it in a nicer, kinder, gentler way) but the message was he had a weight problem.

So if Sims leaves, are there any "Corey Brewers" out there who want to play for Tubby's Cats?



I said i thought Sims would move on a couple weeks ago, wouldn't suprise me if a few more followed. we'll see. i think sims is a good player, as evidenced by his peformances earlier this season... he just doesn't fit in tubby 'system" whatever that is and entails... Again like Bourbour and others, you aren't a sudden, if i r ecall correctly, a juco all american or first team and suddenly can't shoot or play a lick. the back injury thing was just spin, he did have an injury, butit seems like i read myself that he said his back was fully healed.

[Chunks06]

Houstoncat wrote: Theres some info going around saying Tyler Smith is now considering Pittsburg due to rumors swirling around TS, The Program, and TS going leaving.

The Coach and Administration need to make definitive statements one way or the other. What recruiting we have going on currently is going to take a hit unless some of these issues whether rumor or not are resolved.



Im no expert but I have to trust Tubby on this one. If he is recruiting this guy then he is assuring him one way or the other. You are hearing rumors and saying other rumors need to be stopped. Rumors will never stop. its unfortunate but it is the case. After Tubby's comments postseason and the way the rumors have drastically decreased lately I would say it would be a HUGE surprise if he left and Im sure his recruits have mroe info then us.

[catboxfiller]

:) Raleigh Cat .............email me . I am in Raleigh....relocation! jeff.specht@vendorcap.com

[RP_McMurphy]

All part of the painful process that will be needed to improve our beloved Wildcats during this off-season. It was plainly evident this year that Kentucky needed major shake ups in it's roster and it's coaching staff. If Sims wants to transfer then I say goodbye and thank for you for being Wildcat. As Tubby said once the players should worry about making him happy not him making them happy. It seems that he got away from this statement lately and we have seen the results in the players.

[Wildcat Larry]

Comparing Sims to Barbour is apples and oranges. Just another snipe attack. Sims apparently wasn't willing to sacrafice like you need to in order to play big time college basketball. Hopefully, Sims will come back and dedicate himself, but it's pretty obvious that he didn't completely apply himself this past season, back injury or not.

Going from BMOC to just another goodplayer on a major college team seems to be difficult to pull off for a lot of junior college guys.

[Buddah]

Wildcat Larry wrote: Comparing Sims to Barbour is apples and oranges.


I don't think it is apples and oranges, one was very highly touted in JUCO, was considering jumping from Juco to the NBA, ( there is articles ) and the other was a first team Juco All American and i believe player of the year, and was highly touted. Both of them got here, showed flashes of brillance and good play, then they have injuries that suppoesdly affect themthat they are never themselves again, their confidence is shattered and never play like themselves again. they are both made out to be selfish players that never want to dedicate themselves. there are comparasions with that, even thoguh they play different positions. so we shall see. Regardless good luck to sims.

[DCWildcat]

Buddah wrote: Wildcat Larry wrote: Comparing Sims to Barbour is apples and oranges.


I don't think it is apples and oranges, one was very highly touted in JUCO, was considering jumping from Juco to the NBA, ( there is articles ) and the other was a first team Juco All American and i believe player of the year, and was highly touted. Both of them got here, showed flashes of brillance and good play, then they have injuries that suppoesdly affect themthat they are never themselves again, their confidence is shattered and never play like themselves again. they are both made out to be selfish players that never want to dedicate themselves. there are comparasions with that, even thoguh they play different positions. so we shall see. Regardless good luck to sims.


excellentt post Buddah

[Buddah]

DCWildcat wrote: Buddah wrote: Wildcat Larry wrote: Comparing Sims to Barbour is apples and oranges.


I don't think it is apples and oranges, one was very highly touted in JUCO, was considering jumping from Juco to the NBA, ( there is articles ) and the other was a first team Juco All American and i believe player of the year, and was highly touted. Both of them got here, showed flashes of brillance and good play, then they have injuries that suppoesdly affect themthat they are never themselves again, their confidence is shattered and never play like themselves again. they are both made out to be selfish players that never want to dedicate themselves. there are comparasions with that, even thoguh they play different positions. so we shall see. Regardless good luck to sims.


excellentt post Buddah



I am sure DC ? :rolleyes::ggrin: Always limitations to any study of course you know that.

[catsfan20]

Great post RP. I don't always agree with your negativity, and I happen to be a big believer in Tubby, but I totally agree with this post. TS has gotten away from his stance of the players having to make him happy. Let's hope he gets back to thatnext year, and rights this ship.

[DCWildcat]

Buddah wrote: DCWildcat wrote: Buddah wrote: Wildcat Larry wrote: Comparing Sims to Barbour is apples and oranges.


I don't think it is apples and oranges, one was very highly touted in JUCO, was considering jumping from Juco to the NBA, ( there is articles ) and the other was a first team Juco All American and i believe player of the year, and was highly touted. Both of them got here, showed flashes of brillance and good play, then they have injuries that suppoesdly affect themthat they are never themselves again, their confidence is shattered and never play like themselves again. they are both made out to be selfish players that never want to dedicate themselves. there are comparasions with that, even thoguh they play different positions. so we shall see. Regardless good luck to sims.


excellentt post Buddah



I am sure DC ? :rolleyes::ggrin: Always limitations to any study of course you know that.


:) You just did a very nice job comparing the two and illustrating their similarities. That's all I'm saying.

[RaviMoss#1fan]

hey the sims comment saying he wants to go let him. If he showed in pract and in the game he was a great players then so be it but he never show that one game againest iona when he score 22 that the only game all season he had his a game. The Back Problems showed he cant show up and play his game cause hes hurting. Let him go. Best Wishes Sims.

[Will Lavender]

I wish Sims luck. One of the nicest, most outgoing kids to play for Kentucky in some time.

But, frankly, it's probably better for him. He is a decent offensive player, but he is sooooooo sloooooooow and could absolutely kill you on the defensive end if you kept him out there for long periods of time. Just an sstonishing lack of athleticism. Of course this may have had to do with his back, or it may have had to do with the fact that he put on so much weight to play the power forward spot.

We're talking about a Kentucky team here whose problem was speed and athleticism. We need a rejuvenation next year, both with the guys returning and with the kids coming in, of athletic ability.

Sims doesn't fit in to that rejuvenation, as far as I can see.

[Cat Country]

I agree with you Will, but i would also put Woo, Shag, and Thomas in that catagory, a lot of heart, we just need more athletic players.

[flacat22]

VIIBanners wrote: I was mostly speaking to Flacat. He preaches but doesn't practice.

Why dont you clarify THAT statement! What dont I practice? Having an opinion? The original post mentioned NOTHING about Thomas/Sims playing time only Morris/Sims and that's what I referred to in my response. IF in fact Sims got out of shape and his back injury kept him from playing at 100% how can he/you blame the coach or the program for that? Explain yourself and that comment please, who are you to say something like that?

Nevermind I went back and re-read what you posted about "turning on our own mothers." I dont think he'll be sorely missed, he IS less talented and deserves less PT than Morris and if he doesnt want to be here then I want someone who does want to to take his scholarship. How is that "ugly" or "turning on him?"

[graham51]

Will Lavender wrote: I wish Sims luck. One of the nicest, most outgoing kids to play for Kentucky in some time.

But, frankly, it's probably better for him. He is a decent offensive player, but he is sooooooo sloooooooow and could absolutely kill you on the defensive end if you kept him out there for long periods of time. Just an sstonishing lack of athleticism. Of course this may have had to do with his back, or it may have had to do with the fact that he put on so much weight to play the power forward spot.

We're talking about a Kentucky team here whose problem was speed and athleticism. We need a rejuvenation next year, both with the guys returning and with the kids coming in, of athletic ability.

Sims doesn't fit in to that rejuvenation, as far as I can see.



Did Tubby not know all of this when he recruited him?

[flacat22]

wildcat74 wrote: flacat22 wrote: If thats the case then so be it, good luck at our next stop (for 1 year). Kentucky didnt cause the back injury and his lack of skills (in comparison to Morris') or drive to improve isnt Tubby's fault either. Hate to see anyone leave given the current state of the team but I dont think his departure would be as devastating as if other current Cats left.



He may not have morris' talent, but he surely has more than sheray. IMO, the minutes for these 2 should have been reversed this year.




maybe, but due to his injury and other reasons that only Tubby knows we may never saw this past year and may never see again the REAL Rekalin Sims that came in so hyped as the JUCO player of the year.

[Will Lavender]

graham51 wrote: Will Lavender wrote: I wish Sims luck. One of the nicest, most outgoing kids to play for Kentucky in some time.

But, frankly, it's probably better for him. He is a decent offensive player, but he is sooooooo sloooooooow and could absolutely kill you on the defensive end if you kept him out there for long periods of time. Just an sstonishing lack of athleticism. Of course this may have had to do with his back, or it may have had to do with the fact that he put on so much weight to play the power forward spot.

We're talking about a Kentucky team here whose problem was speed and athleticism. We need a rejuvenation next year, both with the guys returning and with the kids coming in, of athletic ability.

Sims doesn't fit in to that rejuvenation, as far as I can see.



Did Tubby not know all of this when he recruited him?

I think Sims was probably recruited to be a banger and to help us on the glass. Thus the weight gain. But I don't think Tubby factored in that (1) Sims would lose so much foot speed and (2) Sims would sustain a back injury.

And plus, the upside with Sims, given the bad back, was his ability to hit perimter shots. Well, both Sheray and Bobby are better shooters. So, really, what did Sims bring to the table?

I hope he gets everything in order, graduates, and makes good of himself in the world. God knows he has the personality to win people over. Great, great young man.

[RaviMoss#1fan]

not going to say this but from a friend in lexington at uk said he likes to party alot and tubby wasnt happy with that.

[Will Lavender]

Buck Naked wrote: Sims is just the most recent in a long line of players that have either transferred or considered transferring out of Tubby's program.
I don't know what you want.

Hell, we complain about the terrible season. We lament the fact that Tubby is too stubborn, that he won't do anything to remedy the situation. We prophesy - or at least some of us do - a long line of "mediocre" seasons because Tubby is too stubborn to change.

And then he begins to clean house, and we bemoan that, too.

Can't have it both ways. If you have a bad season, players and coaches have to go. That's just the way it is everywhere, not just at Kentucky. Billy Donovan has had his fair share of transfers as well (more than Tubby has, actually), and he's shaken up his coaching staff a couple of times, and it has certainly paid off.

[flacat22]

VIIBanners wrote: I was mostly speaking to Flacat. He preaches but doesn't practice.

still waiting...explain yourself

[I. Melvin]

Sims is probably the best example of the incoherence that seemed to reign this year.

Early in the year, Sims looked to be exactly what we needed at the worrisome 4-spot. Contrary to what Will saw, I saw a quick leaper around the goal, instinctive offensive player in the paint, good rebounder, warrior spirit, PLUS, he could hit an outside shot - something Chuck couldn't do to save his soul.

He and Jared looked like a bright future. And, if you'll remember, they seemed to blend well with Rajon.

Then, POOF - through the looking glass we went. 900 different lineups. Substitutions just as players were getting in their zone. Nightly reinventions.

The only thing (other than dementia) that made sense to me was that OTS was searching in vain for his 2003 team. It was Captain Queeg and his surly men.

And that's what worries me most about continuing with Tubby at the helm. Who are we, Coach? What the hell is it that you're trying to create? What is your vision for Kentucky Basketball? Do you have one?

Chuck Hayes is not walking through that door. It's clear to me that Chuck was our #1 assistant the last few years. I'm almost sorry he stuck with the Rockets - he'd look good in a coat and tie on our bench - maybe Tubby could then regain his composure.

After our second (not even our third - that would come later in Lawrence) humiliation, I listened to the coach's show. I was honestly worried about the man. Tom Leach was practically finishing his sentences for him. That we didn't completely implode like the Las Vegas Hilton frankly surprised me.

I'm old enough to remember how it felt when the wheels starting coming off under Sutton. Seems like deja vu all over again to me ...

[Will Lavender]

I. Melvin wrote: Sims is probably the best example of the incoherence that seemed to reign this year.

Early in the year, Sims looked to be exactly what we needed at the worrisome 4-spot. Contrary to what Will saw, I saw a quick leaper around the goal, instinctive offensive player in the paint, good rebounder, warrior spirit, PLUS, he could hit an outside shot - something Chuck couldn't do to save his soul.

He and Jared looked like a bright future. And, if you'll remember, they seemed to blend well with Rajon.

Then, POOF - through the looking glass we went. 900 different lineups. Substitutions just as players were getting in their zone. Nightly reinventions.

The only thing (other than dementia) that made sense to me was that OTS was searching in vain for his 2003 team. It was Captain Queeg and his surly men.

And that's what worries me most about continuing with Tubby at the helm. Who are we, Coach? What the hell is it that you're trying to create? What is your vision for Kentucky Basketball? Do you have one?

Chuck Hayes is not walking through that door. It's clear to me that Chuck was our #1 assistant the last few years. I'm almost sorry he stuck with the Rockets - he'd look good in a coat and tie on our bench - maybe Tubby could then regain his composure.

After our second (not even our third - that would come later in Lawrence) humiliation, I listened to the coach's show. I was honestly worried about the man. Tom Leach was practically finishing his sentences for him. That we didn't completely implode like the Las Vegas Hilton frankly surprised me.

I'm old enough to remember how it felt when the wheels starting coming off under Sutton. Seems like deja vu all over again to me ...


Yeah, but the operative words there are "early in the year."

I don't think Sims' performance early on (one of his best games, remember, was in an exhibition contest) was indicative of the player he was. Especially not defensively. The kid was just horrid defensively, thanks in part to the bad back and I guess to the luggage he was carrying in his gut.

We were playing too many people in December. Everybody on this board was shouting for Tubby to cut back the rotation. Now we can debate whether Sheray or Reaklin should have gotten those minutes, but it was clear that we couldn't be playing 11 people anymore or we were never going to get in any kind of rhythm. It was no surprise that we were playing our best basketball toward the end when we had a 9-man rotation.

[ridgecat78]

We need Rekalin Sims. PERIOD. How many of you have ever had back problems? I have and it sucks. I was just trying to get out of bed and get to work, let alone play SEC hoops. He is a wing player not a power forward or center. Has proven he can hit the 3 and has a nose for the ball underneath. Get off of his "back". Hopefully this summer he can get his back under control. If not here's hoping for successful surgery and a medical redshirt for a killer senior campaign with Randolph & crew to hang another banner.

[I. Melvin]

And where was this rhythm of which you speak? ;)

Is it accurate to say that had Bobby not blossomed, we'd never have had the opportunity to give our gallant effort against UCONN (diminished, as it seems, by subsequent events)?

Hell, had Bobby not stepped up, it's very likely we wouldn't have even made the NCAA's - or, at best, lost our first game in the Tourney (think it's contentious now? just imagine ... )

Am I wrong to be troubled - not so much by the record, but by what I perceive to be incoherent leadership? Is that an innacurate observation? Why did this year feel like watching JLo in Hudson's Hamburger Hill Offense?

Oh, well. To specifics - what type of Power Forward best serves a Tubby Smith-coached team? I don't think the answer is necessarily a Chuck Hayes type (his intangibles were so off the chart that it queers the thinking). I suspect Stevenson fits the role, but it's sure asking a lot of a skinny freshman...

[allday]

Normally, i would try to stay away from topics such as this. I tend to infuriate some people on here and im not here to debate with anyone.... But! This is my take...

Sims is not a power forward. We lowered the standards of Kentucky basketball to accept a Juco transfer to be our power forward and he turns out to have a bad back....well thats acceptable to one of my cousins with a comp case tied up in court but not at UK. Im sorry, but this kid should not be able to sniff a interest from UK to play here and now he wants to leave...ok....GOODBYE.

Here is a novel idea....RECRUIT TWO POWER FORWARDS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Hell recruit one a year!!!

I'm sick of excuses. I like Tubby Smith but come on. DO YOUR JOB!!!!! We don't want to hear about the standard of basketball of Kentucky. We know the standard. We have been here and we will be here. Put up or shut up.

The fact that we are talking about a sub par player like Rekalin Sims transerfing is somewhat embarssing.

[wyldkatzky]

Forget blue goggles, or glasses the back of your retina must be blue.

Goodluck.

allday wrote: Normally, i would try to stay away from topics such as this. I tend to infuriate some people on here and im not here to debate with anyone.... But! This is my take...

Sims is not a power forward. We lowered the standards of Kentucky basketball to accept a Juco transfer to be our power forward and he turns out to have a bad back....well thats acceptable to one of my cousins with a comp case tied up in court but not at UK. Im sorry, but this kid should not be able to sniff a interest from UK to play here and now he wants to leave...ok....GOODBYE.

Here is a novel idea....RECRUIT TWO POWER FORWARDS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Hell recruit one a year!!!

I'm sick of excuses. I like Tubby Smith but come on. DO YOUR JOB!!!!! We don't want to hear about the standard of basketball of Kentucky. We know the standard. We have been here and we will be here. Put up or shut up.

The fact that we are talking about a sub par player like Rekalin Sims transerfing is somewhat embarssing.

[flacat22]

sorry I agree with Allday, we should recruit power forwards and not try to create them out of lesser talent once they are here. You cant teach 6'10/260. Look at the Final Four and the size and strength of the teams there....THATS where we should be and until we star recruiting a presence on the low blocks we'll continue griping at each other as to reasons why we are not there...

[RaleighCat]

flacat22 wrote: sorry I agree with Allday, we should recruit power forwards and not try to create them out of lesser talent once they are here. You cant teach 6'10/260. Look at the Final Four and the size and strength of the teams there....THATS where we should be and until we star recruiting a presence on the low blocks we'll continue griping at each other as to reasons why we are not there...

Amen.

And double AMEN to I. Melvin's post.

[Lost Highway]

Kentucky should not be in the position of having to bring in Junior College players. They should be reloading every year not frantically looking for someone to fill a spot at the last minute.

[allday]

wyldkatzky wrote: Forget blue goggles, or glasses the back of your retina must be blue.

Goodluck.

allday wrote: Normally, i would try to stay away from topics such as this. I tend to infuriate some people on here and im not here to debate with anyone.... But! This is my take...

Sims is not a power forward. We lowered the standards of Kentucky basketball to accept a Juco transfer to be our power forward and he turns out to have a bad back....well thats acceptable to one of my cousins with a comp case tied up in court but not at UK. Im sorry, but this kid should not be able to sniff a interest from UK to play here and now he wants to leave...ok....GOODBYE.

Here is a novel idea....RECRUIT TWO POWER FORWARDS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Hell recruit one a year!!!

I'm sick of excuses. I like Tubby Smith but come on. DO YOUR JOB!!!!! We don't want to hear about the standard of basketball of Kentucky. We know the standard. We have been here and we will be here. Put up or shut up.

The fact that we are talking about a sub par player like Rekalin Sims transerfing is somewhat embarssing.




How is this seeing things throught blue goggles. Am I wrong??? We have 0 power forwards. So tell me how that is seeing things blue. I am seeing reality! We got lucky with Chuck Hayes. He was all heart. That was lightning in a bottle.We need power forwards. Plain and simple. We do not need to try and get juco players to fill positions that we should have filled already.

[Buddah]

allday wrote:


Sims is not a power forward. We lowered the standards of Kentucky basketball to accept a Juco transfer to be our power forward and he turns out to have a bad back....well thats acceptable to one of my cousins with a comp case tied up in court but not at UK. Im sorry, but this kid should not be able to sniff a interest from UK to play here and now he wants to leave...ok....GOODBYE.

Here is a novel idea....RECRUIT TWO POWER FORWARDS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Hell recruit one a year!!!

I'm sick of excuses. I like Tubby Smith but come on. DO YOUR JOB!!!!! We don't want to hear about the standard of basketball of Kentucky. We know the standard. We have been here and we will be here. Put up or shut up.

The fact that we are talking about a sub par player like Rekalin Sims transerfing is somewhat embarssing.

Â*

Â*


Good points, thank you for having the spine to call a spade a spade. We will just have to wait and see how next year shakes out, but we really seem to be lowering our standards, i mean we are in desperate need of a four in the WORST way, and people mainly dance around the issue or say Thomas and Stevenson will fill the bill, just can't buy that. We don't have a power forward, i know it, you know it, and tubby seems to know it, yet here we sit. I pray we get Darrell Authur... who knows ?

Disclaimer: I am a true fan

[flacat22]

I didnt think so...

[katfever]

Frankly, Tubby plays favorites imo. Thomas brought nothing to the table during the season- poor defense, not motivated, poor offense. He played slightly better during the postseason, but Sims offered more. I believe the back stuff is a crock- Sims may have had back trouble but he never was given a chance when put in the game. Jerked after a minute or two, yet Thomas was left in time after time getting beat on defense or missing gimmes. Same deal with Shag- he says his grades are fine- he has always been eligible. Somehow he rides the bench when Woo gets beat on defense or hacks endlessly. Examples of poor player management.

[allday]

katfever wrote: Frankly, Tubby plays favorites imo. Thomas brought nothing to the table during the season- poor defense, not motivated, poor offense. He played slightly better during the postseason, but Sims offered more. I believe the back stuff is a crock- Sims may have had back trouble but he never was given a chance when put in the game. Jerked after a minute or two, yet Thomas was left in time after time getting beat on defense or missing gimmes. Same deal with Shag- he says his grades are fine- he has always been eligible. Somehow he rides the bench when Woo gets beat on defense or hacks endlessly. Examples of poor player management.
Excellent point here. Wake up stooges. This is so true its scary. Alleyne spoke volumes when he talked after the loss to UCONN. He has no academic problems. Did anyone notice there was no rebutle from Tubby on this. If I was a coach that was setting a player for those reasons, and he came out and said they were not true, I'd have something to say about it.

Does anyone here feel like this season with all this going onwas twilight zone material.... It's like Tubby flew in for the games from Mizzoula, Montana and had really no clue....

The thing that made me the sickest about this season was Tubby stalking the bench looking for someone to put in....YOU REAP WHAT YOU SEW......

[DCWildcat]

allday wrote: Normally, i would try to stay away from topics such as this. I tend to infuriate some people on here and im not here to debate with anyone.... But! This is my take...

Sims is not a power forward. We lowered the standards of Kentucky basketball to accept a Juco transfer to be our power forward and he turns out to have a bad back....well thats acceptable to one of my cousins with a comp case tied up in court but not at UK. Im sorry, but this kid should not be able to sniff a interest from UK to play here and now he wants to leave...ok....GOODBYE.

Here is a novel idea....RECRUIT TWO POWER FORWARDS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Hell recruit one a year!!!

I'm sick of excuses. I like Tubby Smith but come on. DO YOUR JOB!!!!! We don't want to hear about the standard of basketball of Kentucky. We know the standard. We have been here and we will be here. Put up or shut up.

The fact that we are talking about a sub par player like Rekalin Sims transerfing is somewhat embarssing.






Labeling someone a "Juco" and deciding their ability to play ball based on that is such a horrible criterion that it's almost laughable. Besides that being a silly label, it's just inaccurate: there's tons of good talent in the juco ranks every year.

As for recruiting power forwards, your point is also way off. Let's see, this year Tubby has recruited Darrell Arthur, Thaddeus Young (who would play 4 for us), Brandan Wright, and Perry Stevenson. Those are just the ones off the top of my head. That's 4....4>1. Whether or not he gets them is a different issue--he's been bad at that. But you can't fault him for not trying.

Calm logic....

[Aike]

Fans play favorites. Fans decide that Sims, Bradley, and Alleyne should have been playing more. The coach, who watches them practice every day, and knows a lot more about their personal situations than anyone on this board, felt differently, especially about Sims and Alleyne.

Had you been the coach, is it possible that you would have seen things differently than you did as a casual observer?

allday wrote: katfever wrote: Frankly, Tubby plays favorites imo. Thomas brought nothing to the table during the season- poor defense, not motivated, poor offense. He played slightly better during the postseason, but Sims offered more. I believe the back stuff is a crock- Sims may have had back trouble but he never was given a chance when put in the game. Jerked after a minute or two, yet Thomas was left in time after time getting beat on defense or missing gimmes. Same deal with Shag- he says his grades are fine- he has always been eligible. Somehow he rides the bench when Woo gets beat on defense or hacks endlessly. Examples of poor player management.
Excellent point here. Wake up stooges. This is so true its scary. Alleyne spoke volumes when he talked after the loss to UCONN. He has no academic problems. Did anyone notice there was no rebutle from Tubby on this. If I was a coach that was setting a player for those reasons, and he came out and said they were not true, I'd have something to say about it.

Does anyone here feel like this season with all this going onwas twilight zone material.... It's like Tubby flew in for the games from Mizzoula, Montana and had really no clue....

The thing that made me the sickest about this season was Tubby stalking the bench looking for someone to put in....YOU REAP WHAT YOU SEW......

[Stretch]

Maybe Tubby expects more out of Alleyne academically than just being eligible. If he is cutting classes, he needs to sit even if his grades are OK. Tubby is trying to develop disciplined, productive and conscientious human beings here also.

[Will Lavender]

allday wrote: katfever wrote: Frankly, Tubby plays favorites imo. Thomas brought nothing to the table during the season- poor defense, not motivated, poor offense. He played slightly better during the postseason, but Sims offered more. I believe the back stuff is a crock- Sims may have had back trouble but he never was given a chance when put in the game. Jerked after a minute or two, yet Thomas was left in time after time getting beat on defense or missing gimmes. Same deal with Shag- he says his grades are fine- he has always been eligible. Somehow he rides the bench when Woo gets beat on defense or hacks endlessly. Examples of poor player management.
Excellent point here. Wake up stooges. This is so true its scary. Alleyne spoke volumes when he talked after the loss to UCONN. He has no academic problems. Did anyone notice there was no rebutle from Tubby on this. If I was a coach that was setting a player for those reasons, and he came out and said they were not true, I'd have something to say about it.

Does anyone here feel like this season with all this going onwas twilight zone material.... It's like Tubby flew in for the games from Mizzoula, Montana and had really no clue....

The thing that made me the sickest about this season was Tubby stalking the bench looking for someone to put in....YOU REAP WHAT YOU SEW......

Anybody who disagrees with you is a stooge?

We're talking opinions here. You can't barge into the thread and decide that you have the right answer and everyone else is idiotic for daring to disagree with you.

And Stretch and Aike make the perfect rebuttals. Your Alleyne point is flat because Shagari wouldn't go to class. That's a bit different than "academic problems," which connotes that his grades are bad. As far as I know Shagari was passing; if he wasn't then he'd be cut. But passing isn't all you have to do if you're a student. You've also got to meet with the tutors, go to class, make sure that you are, you know, doing the things that student athletes are bound by their scholarship to do. Shagari hasn't done that, and he wasn't doing that this year. Can't play someone who won't do the things he needs to do off the floor to get playing time.

And really, it looks to me like Tubby gave everybody a chance this year. Rekalin even got a change to play late in the year, and then he smacktalked Joakim Noah and failed to back it up. Guess what? Back to the bench. But then Rekalin got another chance to prove himself in the SEC Tournament, and he made good on it.

It's not like Tubby wasn't giving these kids chances.

A man in Nashville said to me, "Tubby's ruined Patrick Sparks. Every time he does something wrong he puts him on the bench."

Well, all I have to say to that is: Patrick is lucky he even got off the bench again after the way he played in November and December. He had one of the poorest first halves I've ever seen out of a Kentucky starter, and Tubby stuck with him.

I saw no playing favorites. You look at Rekalin Sims and say "he's GOT to be out there." I look at Rekalin and see a guy who couldn't guard me on the defensive end because of an astonishing lack of foot speed.

Sims deserved to sit, IMO, because our problem this year - early on moreso than late in the season - was that we were atrociously bad on the defensive end. How do you play bad defensive players when you're trying to improve defensively?

[OldCatFan]

As for recruiting power forwards, your point is also way off. Let's see, this year Tubby has recruited Darrell Arthur, Thaddeus Young (who would play 4 for us), Brandan Wright, and Perry Stevenson. Those are just the ones off the top of my head. That's 4....4>1. Whether or not he gets them is a different issue--he's been bad at that. But you can't fault him for not trying.

Calm logic....

I do not think it is a case of recruiting. Any coach can find players that they want to sign. The bottom line is in getting them to sign on the dotted line. This is what Coach Smith is having problems with. Something is wrong. I and no one else on this forum really knows what the problem is because we are not involved in it, but there is a problem somewhere.

[poodoo]

Fans play favorites. Fans decide that Sims, Bradley, and Alleyne should have been playing more. The coach, who watches them practice every day, and knows a lot more about their personal situations than anyone on this board, felt differently, especially about Sims and Alleyne.

Had you been the coach, is it possible that you would have seen things differently than you did as a casual observer? QUOTE by Aike

________

Exactly. I still remember how Keith Bogans received some boos from UK fans when they were wanting Rashad Carruth to get more of Bogans' minutes. Carruth was a "fan favorite." Hmmm. Yes, that's the same Carruth that endured some suspensions and was eventually "encouraged" to leave Team Turmoil. :(

We fans are exactly the ones who "play favorites." We do not know the whole story. We do not know what goes on at practice or off the court (beyond Shagari's failing to attend class, and a team requirment is for players to attend their academic classes, period!). I do know Tubby has always been just a bit reserved in his praise for both Shagari and Sims, for whatever the reason. I suspect he thinks both need to make developing into better players a more important part of their lives. Too, like others, I saw Sims' defensive deficiencies as a great concern for Tubby, and understandably so.

FWIW, though, I do think Tubby sees more in Sheray than most of us fans, including me myself. His trust in Sheray backfired in the LSU game. Sheray is obviously a really good kid who was down on himselfafter missing that shot. It was good to see him play harder andwith more confidence the UCONN game. Let's just hope Sheray improves AND that Rekalin improves, especially on defense,if he stays with the Cats. I would love to see both playersimproved next season, as we so need improvement at that power forward position.

[Chunks06]

Will Lavender wrote: allday wrote: katfever wrote: Frankly, Tubby plays favorites imo. Thomas brought nothing to the table during the season- poor defense, not motivated, poor offense. He played slightly better during the postseason, but Sims offered more. I believe the back stuff is a crock- Sims may have had back trouble but he never was given a chance when put in the game. Jerked after a minute or two, yet Thomas was left in time after time getting beat on defense or missing gimmes. Same deal with Shag- he says his grades are fine- he has always been eligible. Somehow he rides the bench when Woo gets beat on defense or hacks endlessly. Examples of poor player management.
Excellent point here. Wake up stooges. This is so true its scary. Alleyne spoke volumes when he talked after the loss to UCONN. He has no academic problems. Did anyone notice there was no rebutle from Tubby on this. If I was a coach that was setting a player for those reasons, and he came out and said they were not true, I'd have something to say about it.

Does anyone here feel like this season with all this going onwas twilight zone material.... It's like Tubby flew in for the games from Mizzoula, Montana and had really no clue....

The thing that made me the sickest about this season was Tubby stalking the bench looking for someone to put in....YOU REAP WHAT YOU SEW......

Anybody who disagrees with you is a stooge?

We're talking opinions here. You can't barge into the thread and decide that you have the right answer and everyone else is idiotic for daring to disagree with you.

And Stretch and Aike make the perfect rebuttals. Your Alleyne point is flat because Shagari wouldn't go to class. That's a bit different than "academic problems," which connotes that his grades are bad. As far as I know Shagari was passing; if he wasn't then he'd be cut. But passing isn't all you have to do if you're a student. You've also got to meet with the tutors, go to class, make sure that you are, you know, doing the things that student athletes are bound by their scholarship to do. Shagari hasn't done that, and he wasn't doing that this year. Can't play someone who won't do the things he needs to do off the floor to get playing time.

And really, it looks to me like Tubby gave everybody a chance this year. Rekalin even got a change to play late in the year, and then he smacktalked Joakim Noah and failed to back it up. Guess what? Back to the bench. But then Rekalin got another chance to prove himself in the SEC Tournament, and he made good on it.

It's not like Tubby wasn't giving these kids chances.

A man in Nashville said to me, "Tubby's ruined Patrick Sparks. Every time he does something wrong he puts him on the bench."

Well, all I have to say to that is: Patrick is lucky he even got off the bench again after the way he played in November and December. He had one of the poorest first halves I've ever seen out of a Kentucky starter, and Tubby stuck with him.

I saw no playing favorites. You look at Rekalin Sims and say "he's GOT to be out there." I look at Rekalin and see a guy who couldn't guard me on the defensive end because of an astonishing lack of foot speed.

Sims deserved to sit, IMO, because our problem this year - early on moreso than late in the season - was that we were atrociously bad on the defensive end. How do you play bad defensive players when you're trying to improve defensively?




:thumbup:thumbup:thumbup:thumbup:thumbup

I am beginning to think you should be an assistant Will.

I dont think you get to be an elite coach at an elite program by playing favorites. We have no idea what these guys do in practice. Coaches have systems. Tubby has a system. He plays who he feels is giving the best effort and fitting into the system. To me, a stooge is a person that makes assumptions on the 80 minutes of basketball they see a week rather than the guy who makes decisions on these same 80 minutes plus about 1000 more minutes of practice.

[katfever]

Will Lavender wrote: allday wrote: katfever wrote: Frankly, Tubby plays favorites imo. Thomas brought nothing to the table during the season- poor defense, not motivated, poor offense. He played slightly better during the postseason, but Sims offered more. I believe the back stuff is a crock- Sims may have had back trouble but he never was given a chance when put in the game. Jerked after a minute or two, yet Thomas was left in time after time getting beat on defense or missing gimmes. Same deal with Shag- he says his grades are fine- he has always been eligible. Somehow he rides the bench when Woo gets beat on defense or hacks endlessly. Examples of poor player management.


Anybody who disagrees with you is a stooge?

We're talking opinions here. You can't barge into the thread and decide that you have the right answer and everyone else is idiotic for daring to disagree with you.

And Stretch and Aike make the perfect rebuttals. Your Alleyne point is flat because Shagari wouldn't go to class. That's a bit different than "academic problems," which connotes that his grades are bad. As far as I know Shagari was passing; if he wasn't then he'd be cut. But passing isn't all you have to do if you're a student. You've also got to meet with the tutors, go to class, make sure that you are, you know, doing the things that student athletes are bound by their scholarship to do. Shagari hasn't done that, and he wasn't doing that this year. Can't play someone who won't do the things he needs to do off the floor to get playing time.

And really, it looks to me like Tubby gave everybody a chance this year. Rekalin even got a change to play late in the year, and then he smacktalked Joakim Noah and failed to back it up. Guess what? Back to the bench. But then Rekalin got another chance to prove himself in the SEC Tournament, and he made good on it.

It's not like Tubby wasn't giving these kids chances.

A man in Nashville said to me, "Tubby's ruined Patrick Sparks. Every time he does something wrong he puts him on the bench."

Well, all I have to say to that is: Patrick is lucky he even got off the bench again after the way he played in November and December. He had one of the poorest first halves I've ever seen out of a Kentucky starter, and Tubby stuck with him.

I saw no playing favorites. You look at Rekalin Sims and say "he's GOT to be out there." I look at Rekalin and see a guy who couldn't guard me on the defensive end because of an astonishing lack of foot speed.

Sims deserved to sit, IMO, because our problem this year - early on moreso than late in the season - was that we were atrociously bad on the defensive end. How do you play bad defensive players when you're trying to improve defensively?

Well, Will I don't think you are a stooge- well maybe for liking the Reds. :PAs far as the substance of your post, you are right I was not in practice. I am also well aware Tubby has forgotten more basketball than I will ever know. However, I can comment on what I see on the court and what the players say. First of all, with regard to Sims, do not even try to tell me Thomas was more productive on the court- if he wasn't getting beat on defense he was throwing the ball away or missing easy shots. His fot speed was horrible also. Yet Tubby gave him chance after chance. What I saw with Sims was a decent outside stroke and a knack for getting to the ball. As far as Shag, he stated plainly he was NOT missing class. His grades were good. Do you have any proof otherwise? Would Shag blatantly lie about it to the press when it could be checked out? It reminds me of Hawkins- Tubby said he would not play him due to asthma- Cliff said that it wasn't a problem. HMMM Same stuff different player. Tubby does play favorites and once you are on the outside looking in, you are screwed.

[Terry L. Wildcat]

Lost Highway wrote: Kentucky should not be in the position of having to bring in Junior College players. They should be reloading every year not frantically looking for someone to fill a spot at the last minute.
:thumbup Coach Smith needs to get our recruiting act together.

[Will Lavender]

katfever wrote: Will Lavender wrote: allday wrote: katfever wrote: Frankly, Tubby plays favorites imo. Thomas brought nothing to the table during the season- poor defense, not motivated, poor offense. He played slightly better during the postseason, but Sims offered more. I believe the back stuff is a crock- Sims may have had back trouble but he never was given a chance when put in the game. Jerked after a minute or two, yet Thomas was left in time after time getting beat on defense or missing gimmes. Same deal with Shag- he says his grades are fine- he has always been eligible. Somehow he rides the bench when Woo gets beat on defense or hacks endlessly. Examples of poor player management.


Anybody who disagrees with you is a stooge?

We're talking opinions here. You can't barge into the thread and decide that you have the right answer and everyone else is idiotic for daring to disagree with you.

And Stretch and Aike make the perfect rebuttals. Your Alleyne point is flat because Shagari wouldn't go to class. That's a bit different than "academic problems," which connotes that his grades are bad. As far as I know Shagari was passing; if he wasn't then he'd be cut. But passing isn't all you have to do if you're a student. You've also got to meet with the tutors, go to class, make sure that you are, you know, doing the things that student athletes are bound by their scholarship to do. Shagari hasn't done that, and he wasn't doing that this year. Can't play someone who won't do the things he needs to do off the floor to get playing time.

And really, it looks to me like Tubby gave everybody a chance this year. Rekalin even got a change to play late in the year, and then he smacktalked Joakim Noah and failed to back it up. Guess what? Back to the bench. But then Rekalin got another chance to prove himself in the SEC Tournament, and he made good on it.

It's not like Tubby wasn't giving these kids chances.

A man in Nashville said to me, "Tubby's ruined Patrick Sparks. Every time he does something wrong he puts him on the bench."

Well, all I have to say to that is: Patrick is lucky he even got off the bench again after the way he played in November and December. He had one of the poorest first halves I've ever seen out of a Kentucky starter, and Tubby stuck with him.

I saw no playing favorites. You look at Rekalin Sims and say "he's GOT to be out there." I look at Rekalin and see a guy who couldn't guard me on the defensive end because of an astonishing lack of foot speed.

Sims deserved to sit, IMO, because our problem this year - early on moreso than late in the season - was that we were atrociously bad on the defensive end. How do you play bad defensive players when you're trying to improve defensively?

Well, Will I don't think you are a stooge- well maybe for liking the Reds. :PAs far as the substance of your post, you are right I was not in practice. I am also well aware Tubby has forgotten more basketball than I will ever know. However, I can comment on what I see on the court and what the players say. First of all, with regard to Sims, do not even try to tell me Thomas was more productive on the court- if he wasn't getting beat on defense he was throwing the ball away or missing easy shots. His fot speed was horrible also. Yet Tubby gave him chance after chance. What I saw with Sims was a decent outside stroke and a knack for getting to the ball. As far as Shag, he stated plainly he was NOT missing class. His grades were good. Do you have any proof otherwise? Would Shag blatantly lie about it to the press when it could be checked out? It reminds me of Hawkins- Tubby said he would not play him due to asthma- Cliff said that it wasn't a problem. HMMM Same stuff different player. Tubby does play favorites and once you are on the outside looking in, you are screwed.
As I said earlier in the thread, I don't want to debate Sheray vs. Sims. Frankly, I think they both suck. I don't think either of them should have played much at all this year. You look back at the decent games they had, though, and you could probably make the point that Sheray deserved to play just a little more. He probably had 5 "good" games all year; Rekalin may have had 3 or 4. It was close.

I do know this: Sheray didn't hurt the team as much as Rekalin Sims did. Sims was such a lackluster defender that he could absolutely destroy you singlehandedly on defense. Sheray, even though he clearly has deficicencies in his game, was not a guy who would necessarily hurt you too much. Would he help you? Not that I saw. Not consistently, anyway. But his flaws weren't hardly as egregious as Rekalin's.

And I'd like to see a link where Shagari said he was going to class.

As for Cliff Hawkins, Hawkins was erratic as a freshman. It took him until he was a junior to be able to consistently get the ball up the court without turning it over. He was a much more dynamic player than Saul Smith, clearly, but it's not like the team you're referring to struggled because of Saul: that 2001 team was much better than last year's version of the Kentucky Wildcats with Saul at the helm. (And with Cliff Hawkins getting an adequate amount of time off the bench.)

I think the "playing favorites" thing is just a criticism that comes with a horrible year. When you've got five or six guys who aren't getting it done on a consistent basis, you wonder why they're playing and why other guys aren't getting time. But the other guys who are usually mentioned - Jared Carter, Shagari, Rekalin - were also not world beaters.

Let's face it: this team didn't have too many world beaters. Tubby didn't have that many options. I think by the time January came around he was rewarding practice play and hard work. And, progressively, we got a little better as the season went on.

[katfever]

Sims hardly played- and was jerked out immediately when he did play. Thomas got consistent minutes thr/ out the year inspite of his abysmal play. Neither are world beaters- but that is a flaw of Tubby's recruiting. I sure as heck do not blame either player.As far as Shag, I do not have a link but it was in a Courier Journal article after the season was over or close to being over- maybe it still can be viewed online. If I get time, I will look. As far as playing betteras the season progressed- fool's gold as far as I could tell. Decent wins against UT,UAB and Bama but the rest of the games against good competition were losses. Close losses don't count in my book.

[catfando]

Tubby said on his show there would be changes. He also mentioned Sims was getting fat. (well he said it in a nicer, kinder, gentler way) but the message was he had a weight problem.

So if Sims leaves, are there any "Corey Brewers" out there who want to play for Tubby's Cats?




I don't blame Sims for being out of shape. I don't blame Sims for wanting to transfer. We had a poor conditioning program as is evident by the firing of our S&C coordinator. That is IMO, is the coaches fault. What players were Tubby watching in the preseason, and practices to not see that they were poorly conditioned?

Sims showed alot of promise from the start and had a couple of good games. Then Tubby went on to play Sheray Thomas more. Thomas should not even be on this team. He has bricks for hands, makes stupid decisions with the basketball, and stands flat-footed under the basket instead of scrapping for rebounds.

Tubby is a bad evaluator of talent. The best evaluation of talent he has made, since he has been here, is telling Rajon to test the waters. He played his son over Hawkins, ran Bradley off (Michael), continues to recruit guards, guards, guards, when it is evident that this is becoming a bigger more atheletic players game. I'm sick of all of this defending Tubby. He has accomplished nothing since he has been here. Oh yeah, except for conference championships, an elite eight, yada yada yada..........WE ARE IN BIG TROUBLE FOLKS!.......open your eyes and look at what is happening to our program. We are no longer on the decline. We have declined. I see nothing to get excited about next year. I'll bet you my mortgage, that next year at this time we will be in the same boat that we are in this year.

Go ahead and blast me. But I have a right to my opinions just as you do yours. I still love my CATS and will always bleed blue!!!


To me, a stooge is a person that makes assumptions on the 80 minutes of basketball they see a week rather than the guy who makes decisions on these same 80 minutes plus about 1000 more minutes of practice.


They ain't playing the same level of competition in practice.

[Will Lavender]

catfando wrote: Tubby said on his show there would be changes. He also mentioned Sims was getting fat. (well he said it in a nicer, kinder, gentler way) but the message was he had a weight problem.

So if Sims leaves, are there any "Corey Brewers" out there who want to play for Tubby's Cats?




I don't blame Sims for being out of shape. I don't blame Sims for wanting to transfer. We had a poor conditioning program as is evident by the firing of our S&C coordinator. That is IMO, is the coaches fault. What players were Tubby watching in the preseason, and practices to not see that they were poorly conditioned?

Sims showed alot of promise from the start and had a couple of good games. Then Tubby went on to play Sheray Thomas more. Thomas should not even be on this team. He has bricks for hands, makes stupid decisions with the basketball, and stands flat-footed under the basket instead of scrapping for rebounds.

Tubby is a bad evaluator of talent. The best evaluation of talent he has made, since he has been here, is telling Rajon to test the waters. He played his son over Hawkins, ran Bradley off (Michael), continues to recruit guards, guards, guards, when it is evident that this is becoming a bigger more atheletic players game. I'm sick of all of this defending Tubby. He has accomplished nothing since he has been here. Oh yeah, except for conference championships, an elite eight, yada yada yada..........WE ARE IN BIG TROUBLE FOLKS!.......open your eyes and look at what is happening to our program. We are no longer on the decline. We have declined. I see nothing to get excited about next year. I'll bet you my mortgage, that next year at this time we will be in the same boat that we are in this year.

Go ahead and blast me. But I have a right to my opinions just as you do yours. I still love my CATS and will always bleed blue!!!


To me, a stooge is a person that makes assumptions on the 80 minutes of basketball they see a week rather than the guy who makes decisions on these same 80 minutes plus about 1000 more minutes of practice.


They ain't playing the same level of competition in practice.

I love reckless guarantess of pessimism packaged as "I'm just telling it like it is!" and "I'm just calling a spade a spade!" The evangelical "Open your eyes!" is also a good touch that I haven't seen since, oh, 2000.

I also love how "Tubby has done nothing," yet he's got a national championship on the mantle. I'll tell you what: why don't we give that back. And I also love how all of a sudden we've been declining under Tubby for his entire tenure. Based on whose facts? Define "decline."

I say the number of wins and league championships and the NCAA Tournament winning percentage kicks the "We're no longer on the decline" point in the face.

But anyway.

Nice work here. When you anted up with your mortgage, that was...that was just tremendous. You and allday should get together and come up with a greatest posts assortment. You could call it WE'RE RIGHT AND EVERYBODY ELSE IS AN EFFING IDIOT.

:shrug:

[Buddah]

* Don't want to argue or be bashed. I say this in a contrite tone*

Will, the stats don't back up the overall "preception" of the program, notice i said perception. While Tubby and Pitino's regular season numbers are comprable. I think that people feel, and rightly so, in my opinion, they feel the program is on decline because of the post season record, the off the court problems & , the poor conditioning, ungodly amount of transfers, the turmoil, and yes the style of play even. Contrasted with what came before and not just in 90s, and this could be taken as a decline, which that is really what it was.

I am talking about apperences, not nit picking naunced numbers to justify your point of view, that can work both ways. To counter balance your point, we may very well be in the exact shape next season. I have seen nothing, AS OF YET, to rectify the problems that plauged us this past season. Have you ? If we are in the same shape, i think we will see yet a myraid of reckless guarantess of optmism, that will be packaged as " well we have alot of guys transfer last year", " these guys are young", " the guys are learning the system", " who would you get if Tubby left " , " in tubby i trust ", " he has been to three elite eights " " the college has changed", " if not for keith bogan's ankle, we would went to the final four" People's loyalty to the program will probably be questioned as well, if the past is any way to gauge the future.

I have said from the begining that we could be improved next season and have a moderate to good regular season, especially if there alot of early exits in the SEC and we have a very weak conference to play in. I agree that thomas and sims aren't on my list of great power forwards, but that is why i am stunned that we aren't trying to find anyone from juco or unsigned kids to come here. Darrell Arthur would be a god sent for this team, IF WE CAN GET HIM.

I tend to agree that the program has declined. No one thinks nor expects a national title each year. But they shold be near the top of the national rankings and have a national perception. How many times did i watch a televised game this year on a couple of different newtworks, and can't remember the times that someone said " they play the way uk used too", or " they have the talent uk used too", or " uk just isn't playing like they used too" I am sure people over react, and i will label me as one who may have done that. But i don't know how anyone can argue that the general perception of Kentucky isn't what it used to be, or that taken on as a whole Kentucky has declined from where it was when Tubby's tenure began. I type this post in a CONTRITE tone. I don't want to argue with anyone or be bashed. The season is over, and i think we all are tired and it has taken its toll on everyone. I would hate to think that this season has caused posters to look at others in maybe a different light than they had previously, then that would truly be sad.

[Stretch]

I think you need to be contrite, Buddah. You have participated on this board since June of last year and in that short period, you have posted 3200 times. I have read most of 'em, and the vast majority have amounted to slamming Tubby Smith's coaching, recruting, strategy, style of play, substitution patterns, conditioning methods, assistant coaches--anything and everything.

You made those 3200 posts during a very subpar season after UK had been seeded #1, #1 (the overall #1) and #2 in the last three NCAA tournaments and was a double OT game from the Final Four just last March. You ignore all of that, however, because it does not advance your agenda. Your Tubby Smith comparisons are always to what I call the Golden Age of modern UK basketball, the latter part of the Pitino era, a period of unprecedented success in the entire history of UK hoops.

Maybe you are so young that the 90's are all you know. Many of the rest of us, though, are able to context Tubby Smith's performance against some other years that were mighty lean. We remember when Adolph went 13-13 with Riley, Dampier and Jaracz as returning All-Americans; when Joe B. also went 13-13 when Grevey, Flynn, Jimmy Dan and Guyette were juniors; and being relegated to the NIT when Givens, Robey, Phillips and Lee were sophomores.

We also remember the cheating and the shame on the University that resulted.

I believe that Tubby Smith is a wonderful steward for our basketball program. He conducts himself with class and he gives of himself to the community. He conducts an honest program and he wins in an era of great parity and fewer scholarships than any UK coach ever had. He is respected around the country and IMO he is deserving of respect at home.

[catfando]

You made those 3200 posts during a very subpar season after UK had been seeded #1, #1 (the overall #1) and #2 in the last three NCAA tournaments and was a double OT game from the Final Four just last March. You ignore all of that, however, because it does not advance your agenda. Your Tubby Smith comparisons are always to what I call the Golden Age of modern UK basketball, the latter part of the Pitino era, a period of unprecedented success in the entire history of UK hoops.



Yeah, Stretch, and you don't go out of your way to SLAM anyone who disagrees with you that Tubby is the greatest?............All bow to Stretch.....the know all of UK basketball...........WOW a double OT away from a final four, when we were, you said it, the #1 over all seed in the tourney?............Do you even think about what you say?

[Will Lavender]

catfando wrote: You made those 3200 posts during a very subpar season after UK had been seeded #1, #1 (the overall #1) and #2 in the last three NCAA tournaments and was a double OT game from the Final Four just last March. You ignore all of that, however, because it does not advance your agenda. Your Tubby Smith comparisons are always to what I call the Golden Age of modern UK basketball, the latter part of the Pitino era, a period of unprecedented success in the entire history of UK hoops.



Yeah, Stretch, and you don't go out of your way to SLAM anyone who disagrees with you that Tubby is the greatest?............All bow to Stretch.....the know all of UK basketball...........WOW a double OT away from a final four, when we were, you said it, the #1 over all seed in the tourney?............Do you even think about what you say?

I have yet to see anyone say that Tubby Smith is "the greatest."

[blueheretic]

Stretch wrote: I think you need to be contrite, Buddah. You have participated on this board since June of last year and in that short period, you have posted 3200 times. I have read most of 'em, and the vast majority have amounted to slamming Tubby Smith's coaching, recruting, strategy, style of play, substitution patterns, conditioning methods, assistant coaches--anything and everything.

You made those 3200 posts during a very subpar season after UK had been seeded #1, #1 (the overall #1) and #2 in the last three NCAA tournaments and was a double OT game from the Final Four just last March. You ignore all of that, however, because it does not advance your agenda. Your Tubby Smith comparisons are always to what I call the Golden Age of modern UK basketball, the latter part of the Pitino era, a period of unprecedented success in the entire history of UK hoops.

Maybe you are so young that the 90's are all you know. Many of the rest of us, though, are able to context Tubby Smith's performance against some other years that were mighty lean. We remember when Adolph went 13-13 with Riley, Dampier and Jaracz as returning All-Americans; when Joe B. also went 13-13 when Grevey, Flynn, Jimmy Dan and Guyette were juniors; and being relegated to the NIT when Givens, Robey, Phillips and Lee were sophomores.

We also remember the cheating and the shame on the University that resulted.

I believe that Tubby Smith is a wonderful steward for our basketball program. He conducts himself with class and he gives of himself to the community. He conducts an honest program and he wins in an era of great parity and fewer scholarships than any UK coach ever had. He is respected around the country and IMO he is deserving of respect at home.



This amounts to blah blah blah.

Unprecedented? I would say that Rupp himself set the precedent in the 40s/50s. A stretch of Ten years wherein Rupp won four Titles. That would exceed a stretch of 7 years with two titles and four Final Fours.

But that's just me.

Tubby is not getting closer to a Final Four. Hence, the perception of decline.

Tubby still has recruited to the effect of not repairing the most glaring deficiency on his roster. Still no clue how or whom to fill that great big hole. No PF. Weak SFs playing as PFs.

If Bobby Perry continues to improve and can be consistent...perhaps he can bandage that hole.

Tubby needs to get it together. This is not Tulsa. This is not Georgia.

The goals are not the same. The success and the tradtion of success is not at the same level. Expectations are greater because of this.

It's time Tubby came to that realization. He ain't in Kansas anymore. Maybe we need the Wizard to pull him behind the curtain and inform Tubby of this.

[Will Lavender]

Buddah wrote: Will, the stats don't back up the overall "preception" of the program, notice i said perception.
There's a ton in that sentence.

Because stats don't often back up perceptions; stats create objective realities.

And that's the problem, I think, with you and catfando's and allday's stance: you eschew statistics because your perception of Tubby Smith was set a long, long time ago and nothing - no pesky numbers, and especially not any argument from any stupid "Tubby loyalist" - will change your mind. Wins don't matter to you, it seems, because they're often "watered down." Number 1 recruiting classes don't matter to you, it seems, because they "fell into Tubby's lap." Points per game don't matter to you, it seems, because we aren't playing Pitino's style. Defensive statistics don't matter to you, it seems, because anybody who pays attention to those must be in the "cult of defense."

Well, I've got a statistic that's very hard to deflate. In fact, it's almost bloody impenetrable. To me, it creates a very fine perception of the program.

You might be familiar with it. It's called winning percentage.

[Buddah]

Will Lavender wrote:
Buddah wrote: Will, the stats don't back up the overall "preception" of the program, notice i said perception.
There's a ton in that sentence.

Because stats don't often back up perceptions; stats create objective realities.

And that's the problem, I think, with you and catfando's and allday's stance: you eschew statistics because your perception of Tubby Smith was set a long, long time ago and nothing - no pesky numbers, and especially not any argument from any stupid "Tubby loyalist" - will change your mind. Wins don't matter to you, it seems, because they're often "watered down." Number 1 recruiting classes don't matter to you, it seems, because they "fell into Tubby's lap." Points per game don't matter to you, it seems, because we aren't playing Pitino's style. Defensive statistics don't matter to you, it seems, because anybody who pays attention to those must be in the "cult of defense."

Well, I've got a statistic that's very hard to deflate. In fact, it's almost bloody impenetrable. To me, it creates a very fine perception of the program.

You might be familiar with it. It's called winning percentage.


Again in a contrite tone

OKay your putting words in my mouth and your being a little diffcult and being overly defensive. Stats basically amount to regular season numbers, which i outline above ARe comprable to other coaches before him. Where do i not give him credit. Winning percentage is a little bit better, i would gladly trade some regular season numbers for a better to post season record, i think anyone would believe that is how this program is truly gauged. Though as i also outline the overall apperences of the program from the internal problems, post season numbers, off court problems, the ungodly amount of transfers is accurate. I would guess Tubby has had more transfers than any other coach in UK history with the expection of Rupp, which may not be accurate either. Winning percentage is wonderful, but lets see how that winning percentage, basically three years 03 to 05, would have been if we had an SEC like we had this past year. I think that is a legimate question will. Would the numbers have been that astounding ? Nothing wrong with being pragmatic and

To counter balance your point, no matter what Tubby did, and even if the losing countined we would have the reckless promises of optmism with the usual stances, so it truly goes both ways. My perception of Tubby is /was a good coach but not an elite one. In 98, i thought he was an elite coach and even in 99. But i have told this over and over, so no matter what i say will be viewed as anti tubby. As far as recruiting and numbers, its better to gauge his numbers since he has his own players, as far as style of play, it is obivous that we played a totally different style in 98, than we play now. If he could play a similar style to the 03 cats, i would be happy. The much exhaulted recruiting class of 03, we have Rondo gone, Morris done everything he could to leave, and now Bradley was rumored to be considering transfering. Major amount of luck including being second and third choices did have alot to do with that recruiting class, but we got them and i am happy. Tubby has signed 7 Mcdonalds All Americans, 6 of them, including Rondo, have left early or tried to leave early usually under circumstances that wasn't the best in the world. From the casual fan all over the state, the diners, around the water coolers, the overall apperence of the program has declined. I think the program has declined, i think clearly anyone can see that. It is never Tubby's faul though, it is always the kid not wanting to dedicate himself, the kid was a thug, the kid , its the father's fault, tubby can't shot for them. I mean i can understand one or two or even three kids like this over an entire tenure, but and i posted a list earlier this year, to have between 10 and 15 of these kids, just seems to add credence to the theory that he is a horrible evulator of talent. No other way around it, i mean doesn't mean if your a tubby loyalist or are critical of tubby, i mean spade.

When someone thinks of UK, they think of deep tourment runs and retaining the moumentum from the previous season. We seem to spot and pick those things now. We have a pretty good year followed by turmoil. Much like politics in college basketball apperences are everything.

I am glad we can discuss these things and not get personal.

[Buddah]

Stretch wrote:
I think you need to be contrite, Buddah.Â* YouÂ* have participated on this board since June of last year and in that short period, you have posted 3200 times.Â*

Stretch i have been at this board a long time from the WCF to now, i have been around alot longer than you, than tre,and many others. I don't stick around the bball board, i generally posted on the gen discussion and political forums more.. Please get your facts straight..

[Aike]

Have you ever considered typing your responses in Word, then transferring them to this board? Word has many features that I think you might find useful. Just a suggestion. :)

Buddah wrote: Will Lavender wrote:
Buddah wrote: Will, the stats don't back up the overall "preception" of the program, notice i said perception.
There's a ton in that sentence.

Because stats don't often back up perceptions; stats create objective realities.

And that's the problem, I think, with you and catfando's and allday's stance: you eschew statistics because your perception of Tubby Smith was set a long, long time ago and nothing - no pesky numbers, and especially not any argument from any stupid "Tubby loyalist" - will change your mind. Wins don't matter to you, it seems, because they're often "watered down." Number 1 recruiting classes don't matter to you, it seems, because they "fell into Tubby's lap." Points per game don't matter to you, it seems, because we aren't playing Pitino's style. Defensive statistics don't matter to you, it seems, because anybody who pays attention to those must be in the "cult of defense."

Well, I've got a statistic that's very hard to deflate. In fact, it's almost bloody impenetrable. To me, it creates a very fine perception of the program.

You might be familiar with it. It's called winning percentage.


Again in a contrite tone

OKay your putting words in my mouth and your being a little diffcult and being overly defensive. Stats basically amount to regular season numbers, which i outline above ARe comprable to other coaches before him. Where do i not give him credit. Winning percentage is a little bit better, i would gladly trade some regular season numbers for a better to post season record, i think anyone would believe that is how this program is truly gauged. Though as i also outline the overall apperences of the program from the internal problems, post season numbers, off court problems, the ungodly amount of transfers is accurate. I would guess Tubby has had more transfers than any other coach in UK history with the expection of Rupp, which may not be accurate either. Winning percentage is wonderful, but lets see how that winning percentage, basically three years 03 to 05, would have been if we had an SEC like we had this past year. I think that is a legimate question will. Would the numbers have been that astounding ? Nothing wrong with being pragmatic and

To counter balance your point, no matter what Tubby did, and even if the losing countined we would have the reckless promises of optmism with the usual stances, so it truly goes both ways. My perception of Tubby is /was a good coach but not an elite one. In 98, i thought he was an elite coach and even in 99. But i have told this over and over, so no matter what i say will be viewed as anti tubby. As far as recruiting and numbers, its better to gauge his numbers since he has his own players, as far as style of play, it is obivous that we played a totally different style in 98, than we play now. If he could play a similar style to the 03 cats, i would be happy. The much exhaulted recruiting class of 03, we have Rondo gone, Morris done everything he could to leave, and now Bradley was rumored to be considering transfering. Major amount of luck including being second and third choices did have alot to do with that recruiting class, but we got them and i am happy. Tubby has signed 7 Mcdonalds All Americans, 6 of them, including Rondo, have left early or tried to leave early usually under circumstances that wasn't the best in the world. From the casual fan all over the state, the diners, around the water coolers, the overall apperence of the program has declined. I think the program has declined, i think clearly anyone can see that. It is never Tubby's faul though, it is always the kid not wanting to dedicate himself, the kid was a thug, the kid , its the father's fault, tubby can't shot for them. I mean i can understand one or two or even three kids like this over an entire tenure, but and i posted a list earlier this year, to have between 10 and 15 of these kids, just seems to add credence to the theory that he is a horrible evulator of talent. No other way around it, i mean doesn't mean if your a tubby loyalist or are critical of tubby, i mean spade.

When someone thinks of UK, they think of deep and retaining the moumentum from the previous season. We seem to spot and pick those things now. We have a pretty good year followed by turmoil. Much like politics in college basketball apperences are everything.

I am glad we can discuss these things and not get personal.

[Buddah]

Aike wrote:
Have you ever considered typing your responses in Word, then transferring them to this board?Â* Word has many features that I think you might find useful.Â* Just a suggestion.Â* :)

Buddah wrote: Will Lavender wrote:
Buddah wrote: Will, the stats don't back up the overall "preception" of the program, notice i said perception.
There's a ton in that sentence.

Because stats don't often back up perceptions; stats create objective realities.

And that's the problem, I think, with you and catfando's and allday's stance: you eschew statistics because your perception of Tubby Smith was set a long, long time ago and nothing - no pesky numbers, and especially not any argument from any stupid "Tubby loyalist" - will change your mind. Wins don't matter to you, it seems, because they're often "watered down." Number 1 recruiting classes don't matter to you, it seems, because they "fell into Tubby's lap." Points per game don't matter to you, it seems, because we aren't playing Pitino's style. Defensive statistics don't matter to you, it seems, because anybody who pays attention to those must be in the "cult of defense."

Well, I've got a statistic that's very hard to deflate. In fact, it's almost bloody impenetrable. To me, it creates a very fine perception of the program.

You might be familiar with it. It's called winning percentage.


Again in a contrite tone

OKay your putting words in my mouth and your being a little diffcult and being overly defensive. Stats basically amount to regular season numbers, which i outline above ARe comprable to other coaches before him. Where do i not give him credit. Winning percentage is a little bit better, i would gladly trade some regular season numbers for a better to post season record, i think anyone would believe that is how this program is truly gauged. Though as i also outline the overall apperences of the program from the internal problems, post season numbers, off court problems, the ungodly amount of transfers is accurate. I would guess Tubby has had more transfers than any other coach in UK history with the expection of Rupp, which may not be accurate either. Winning percentage is wonderful, but lets see how that winning percentage, basically three years 03 to 05, would have been if we had an SEC like we had this past year. I think that is a legimate question will. Would the numbers have been that astounding ? Nothing wrong with being pragmatic and

To counter balance your point, no matter what Tubby did, and even if the losing countined we would have the reckless promises of optmism with the usual stances, so it truly goes both ways. My perception of Tubby is /was a good coach but not an elite one. In 98, i thought he was an elite coach and even in 99. But i have told this over and over, so no matter what i say will be viewed as anti tubby. As far as recruiting and numbers, its better to gauge his numbers since he has his own players, as far as style of play, it is obivous that we played a totally different style in 98, than we play now. If he could play a similar style to the 03 cats, i would be happy. The much exhaulted recruiting class of 03, we have Rondo gone, Morris done everything he could to leave, and now Bradley was rumored to be considering transfering. Major amount of luck including being second and third choices did have alot to do with that recruiting class, but we got them and i am happy. Tubby has signed 7 Mcdonalds All Americans, 6 of them, including Rondo, have left early or tried to leave early usually under circumstances that wasn't the best in the world. From the casual fan all over the state, the diners, around the water coolers, the overall apperence of the program has declined. I think the program has declined, i think clearly anyone can see that. It is never Tubby's faul though, it is always the kid not wanting to dedicate himself, the kid was a thug, the kid , its the father's fault, tubby can't shot for them. I mean i can understand one or two or even three kids like this over an entire tenure, but and i posted a list earlier this year, to have between 10 and 15 of these kids, just seems to add credence to the theory that he is a horrible evulator of talent. No other way around it, i mean doesn't mean if your a tubby loyalist or are critical of tubby, i mean spade.

When someone thinks of UK, they think of deep and retaining the moumentum from the previous season. We seem to spot and pick those things now. We have a pretty good year followed by turmoil. Much like politics in college basketball apperences are everything.

I am glad we can discuss these things and not get personal.

No, because i don't care enough about these people to do that. they aren't my professors. overly brash tubby supporters over look many valid points made by everyone. instead they attack my spellings, and others loyalty to the program... facts are facts.

[Athens2005]

Buddah wrote: Aike wrote:
Have you ever considered typing your responses in Word, then transferring them to this board? Word has many features that I think you might find useful. Just a suggestion. :)

Buddah wrote: Will Lavender wrote:
Buddah wrote: Will, the stats don't back up the overall "preception" of the program, notice i said perception.
There's a ton in that sentence.

Because stats don't often back up perceptions; stats create objective realities.

And that's the problem, I think, with you and catfando's and allday's stance: you eschew statistics because your perception of Tubby Smith was set a long, long time ago and nothing - no pesky numbers, and especially not any argument from any stupid "Tubby loyalist" - will change your mind. Wins don't matter to you, it seems, because they're often "watered down." Number 1 recruiting classes don't matter to you, it seems, because they "fell into Tubby's lap." Points per game don't matter to you, it seems, because we aren't playing Pitino's style. Defensive statistics don't matter to you, it seems, because anybody who pays attention to those must be in the "cult of defense."

Well, I've got a statistic that's very hard to deflate. In fact, it's almost bloody impenetrable. To me, it creates a very fine perception of the program.

You might be familiar with it. It's called winning percentage.


Again in a contrite tone

OKay your putting words in my mouth and your being a little diffcult and being overly defensive. Stats basically amount to regular season numbers, which i outline above ARe comprable to other coaches before him. Where do i not give him credit. Winning percentage is a little bit better, i would gladly trade some regular season numbers for a better to post season record, i think anyone would believe that is how this program is truly gauged. Though as i also outline the overall apperences of the program from the internal problems, post season numbers, off court problems, the ungodly amount of transfers is accurate. I would guess Tubby has had more transfers than any other coach in UK history with the expection of Rupp, which may not be accurate either. Winning percentage is wonderful, but lets see how that winning percentage, basically three years 03 to 05, would have been if we had an SEC like we had this past year. I think that is a legimate question will. Would the numbers have been that astounding ? Nothing wrong with being pragmatic and

To counter balance your point, no matter what Tubby did, and even if the losing countined we would have the reckless promises of optmism with the usual stances, so it truly goes both ways. My perception of Tubby is /was a good coach but not an elite one. In 98, i thought he was an elite coach and even in 99. But i have told this over and over, so no matter what i say will be viewed as anti tubby. As far as recruiting and numbers, its better to gauge his numbers since he has his own players, as far as style of play, it is obivous that we played a totally different style in 98, than we play now. If he could play a similar style to the 03 cats, i would be happy. The much exhaulted recruiting class of 03, we have Rondo gone, Morris done everything he could to leave, and now Bradley was rumored to be considering transfering. Major amount of luck including being second and third choices did have alot to do with that recruiting class, but we got them and i am happy. Tubby has signed 7 Mcdonalds All Americans, 6 of them, including Rondo, have left early or tried to leave early usually under circumstances that wasn't the best in the world. From the casual fan all over the state, the diners, around the water coolers, the overall apperence of the program has declined. I think the program has declined, i think clearly anyone can see that. It is never Tubby's faul though, it is always the kid not wanting to dedicate himself, the kid was a thug, the kid , its the father's fault, tubby can't shot for them. I mean i can understand one or two or even three kids like this over an entire tenure, but and i posted a list earlier this year, to have between 10 and 15 of these kids, just seems to add credence to the theory that he is a horrible evulator of talent. No other way around it, i mean doesn't mean if your a tubby loyalist or are critical of tubby, i mean spade.

When someone thinks of UK, they think of deep and retaining the moumentum from the previous season. We seem to spot and pick those things now. We have a pretty good year followed by turmoil. Much like politics in college basketball apperences are everything.

I am glad we can discuss these things and not get personal.

No, because i don't care enough about these people to do that. they aren't my professors. overly brash tubby supporters over look many valid points made by everyone. instead they attack my spellings, and others loyalty to the program... facts are facts.

Facts are facts . . .

and ignorance is bliss.

[Buddah]

its sad when you( athens) agree with the person you can't stand. facts are facts, read them... . but said about as much as you can say on this topic.

[justacatsfan]

Buddah, (jokingly tone here), is there a UK coach you dont want gone?

[Aike]

Who can Athens not stand?

Buddah wrote: its sad when you( athens) agree with the person you can't stand. facts are facts, read them... . but said about as much as you can say on this topic.

[Buddah]

justacatsfan wrote:
Buddah, (jokingly tone here), is there a UK coach you dont want gone?

Mickie Demoss, Not Frank... anyone else is fair game.. though the football and bball jobs are two different ballgames... tubby has bought him some extra time, given his regular season record during those three wonderful years, 03 to 05, he had earned it and i have said so.

Rich Brooks on the other hand is and was horrible and never earned anything, including extra time...Plus he is keeping someone i think highly of from being considered for his job. ;)

[justacatsfan]

i just wanted a Leach reference from ya;)

Hey the baseball team is doing darn good now too.



By the way if I was Sims I'd leave too. If someone that looks half asleep on the floor got more minutes than me I would say my time here is up.

[Athens2005]

Buddah wrote: its sad when you( athens) agree with the person you can't stand. facts are facts, read them... . but said about as much as you can say on this topic.

who can't stand whom?

[Buddah]

justacatsfan wrote:
i just wanted a Leach reference from ya;)Â*


I deliver for my fans ;) :cool::cool::cool:

The baseball team is doing very very well, and i would ensure that he stayed around... I used to love college baseball, but for the longest tim our program didn't seem to be committed.. i am very pleased and i would rank the baseball coach with demoss as coaches of the year here..

[lighthouse]

Aike wrote: Who can Athens not stand?

Athens always likes the officials. :shock::lol:

[ukbob]

justacatsfan wrote: Buddah, (jokingly tone here), is there a UK coach you dont want gone?

He probably likes the soccer coach....at least until he loses 2 in a row. LOL

As to the original topic....

If Sims wants to go...BYE. What else can you do or say? His choice.

[Caveman Catfan]

Tubby was a double overtime with a chance for the last shot away from a final four just last year. That is as close to the final four that one can get without making it.

[ukfanforever24]

staying in shape is hard during the season...but what kind of running does uk do during practice? i know sims was hurt so therefore probably didnt do much running...but rember last year joe crawford said he gained a lot of weight during the season because when u dont play a lot u dont get as much exercise during the season cause its a few practices and then a few games and they get fed so much.

[flacat22]

Im still waiting for IIIBanners to defend his statement about me, he's been quiet since I called him out on it...WHAT do I preach but NOT practice? You can disagree with my profession ALL day but dont ever call into question my integrity or character.

[catfando]

And that's the problem, I think, with you and catfando's and allday's stance: you eschew statistics because your perception of Tubby Smith was set a long, long time ago and nothing - no pesky numbers, and especially not any argument from any stupid "Tubby loyalist" - will change your mind. Wins don't matter to you, it seems, because they're often "watered down." Number 1 recruiting classes don't matter to you, it seems, because they "fell into Tubby's lap." Points per game don't matter to you, it seems, because we aren't playing Pitino's style. Defensive statistics don't matter to you, it seems, because anybody who pays attention to those must be in the "cult of defense."

Well, I've got a statistic that's very hard to deflate. In fact, it's almost bloody impenetrable. To me, it creates a very fine perception of the program.

You might be familiar with it. It's called winning percentage.


Will, I love ya brother. Even though you're a Reds fan....:DLOL.....Anyway, let me ask you this question, and if you answer it honestly, then you'll understand my point.

When was the last time we went into a game with a top opponent, and actually were feeling and thinking along the lines of , We gonna wax their butts?...I mean, I knew before the UCONN game we were gonna get waxed. We didn't and for that, I'm proud of these guys. We played gutsy and left it all on the court. But, not since Pitino (Oh God, theirs that name again), have I felt like we had the upper hand on our opponents. Winning percentage doesn't mean anything when you can't win the games that matter. And when has Tubby had the Number One recruiting class?

My mind was made up about Tubby when I consistently saw the same kind of product and basketball on the floor. NO, count it, NO offense. We are the most unfundamentally sound offensive team I've seen. We (and this has got to be the 100th time I've said this), don't set good picks and screens, no good ball movement, don't move good without the ball, and continually try to force an inside game when he has never recruited, outside of Morris, the players to have an inside game. We are too busy trying to dribble around the perimeter looking for the right angle to get the ball inside to players that couldn't catch and make a good post move, when we do get it inside to them. Outside of Morris of course. I mean, Tubby actually set up a play for Thomas when the game was on the line. Anyone can see that we have two players that are good at breaking down their defenders in situations like that. Rondo, and Crawford. Not Sheray Thomas.

I don't think Tubby realizes the gravity of the situation at UK. I don't think he realizes that UK ain't Tulsa, it ain't Georgia. We don't care about winning percentage or conference titles, or regular season records like other schools do. Dean Smith is a prime example of that, to me. He got way more credit than he deserved. Considering he had some of the best talent every year and managed to win 2 championsips in 40 years. He wouldn't have lasted at UK. We set the precedent. We want to be feared by our opponents. Not considered another game on their schedule, like we were this year. We should be able to have the best of the best in players, and in coaches. But players (hansbrough for one) would rather play somewhere else now. Coaches, good ones, are not hired to be a part of this program (by Tubby). To me, he lacks a hunger for being the best. He is satisfied with the status quo, just like he is about the type of player he recruits. It's just not a winning combination in my book. Great man, but not a great coach IMO.

[blueheretic]

Caveman Catfan wrote: Tubby was a double overtime with a chance for the last shot away from a final four just last year. That is as close to the final four that one can get without making it.

Tubby is always a {pick your filler} away from the Final Four--a Bogans ankle injury, a double over time win, a Power Forward...an alchemist.

Or he played the ultimate National Champion to the wire or some such thing.

Those are great excuses but they aren't going to win any National Championships.

He needs to get off of the "I think I can train" and get to doing the things that he needs to do to win. A good start would be efficient and consistent recruiting.

[audacious1]

blueheretic wrote: Stretch wrote: I think you need to be contrite, Buddah. You have participated on this board since June of last year and in that short period, you have posted 3200 times. I have read most of 'em, and the vast majority have amounted to slamming Tubby Smith's coaching, recruting, strategy, style of play, substitution patterns, conditioning methods, assistant coaches--anything and everything.

You made those 3200 posts during a very subpar season after UK had been seeded #1, #1 (the overall #1) and #2 in the last three NCAA tournaments and was a double OT game from the Final Four just last March. You ignore all of that, however, because it does not advance your agenda. Your Tubby Smith comparisons are always to what I call the Golden Age of modern UK basketball, the latter part of the Pitino era, a period of unprecedented success in the entire history of UK hoops.

Maybe you are so young that the 90's are all you know. Many of the rest of us, though, are able to context Tubby Smith's performance against some other years that were mighty lean. We remember when Adolph went 13-13 with Riley, Dampier and Jaracz as returning All-Americans; when Joe B. also went 13-13 when Grevey, Flynn, Jimmy Dan and Guyette were juniors; and being relegated to the NIT when Givens, Robey, Phillips and Lee were sophomores.

We also remember the cheating and the shame on the University that resulted.

I believe that Tubby Smith is a wonderful steward for our basketball program. He conducts himself with class and he gives of himself to the community. He conducts an honest program and he wins in an era of great parity and fewer scholarships than any UK coach ever had. He is respected around the country and IMO he is deserving of respect at home.



This amounts to blah blah blah.

Unprecedented? I would say that Rupp himself set the precedent in the 40s/50s. A stretch of Ten years wherein Rupp won four Titles. That would exceed a stretch of 7 years with two titles and four Final Fours.

But that's just me.

Tubby is not getting closer to a Final Four. Hence, the perception of decline.

Tubby still has recruited to the effect of not repairing the most glaring deficiency on his roster. Still no clue how or whom to fill that great big hole. No PF. Weak SFs playing as PFs.

If Bobby Perry continues to improve and can be consistent...perhaps he can bandage that hole.

Tubby needs to get it together. This is not Tulsa. This is not Georgia.

The goals are not the same. The success and the tradtion of success is not at the same level. Expectations are greater because of this.

It's time Tubby came to that realization. He ain't in Kansas anymore. Maybe we need the Wizard to pull him behind the curtain and inform Tubby of this.

Unbiased graphical representation of UK Coaches since 1931.

http://www.21stcenturypaladin.com/pics/2006/03/kentucky_winloss_lg.gif

[audacious1]

Buddah wrote: Stretch wrote:
I think you need to be contrite, Buddah. You have participated on this board since June of last year and in that short period, you have posted 3200 times.

Stretch i have been at this board a long time from the WCF to now, i have been around alot longer than you, than tre,and many others. I don't stick around the bball board, i generally posted on the gen discussion and political forums more.. Please get your facts straight..




Excuse me but why did you bring up my name?

Also, I don't think it it's legitimate to equate number of posts or length as a member with value of opinion.

[Buddah]

blueheretic wrote:
Caveman Catfan wrote: Tubby was a double overtime with a chance for the last shot away from a final four just last year.Â* That is as close to the final four that one can get without making it.Â*

Tubby is always a {pick your filler} away from the Final Four--a Bogans ankle injury, a double over time win, a Power Forward...an alchemist.

Or he played the ultimate National Champion to the wire or some such thing.

Those are great excuses but they aren't going to win any National Championships.

He needs to get off of the "I think I can train" and get to doing the things that he needs to do to win.Â* A good start would be efficient and consistent recruiting.

Â*


Good Post Dave

[blueheretic]

Tre Pryor wrote: blueheretic wrote: Stretch wrote: I think you need to be contrite, Buddah. You have participated on this board since June of last year and in that short period, you have posted 3200 times. I have read most of 'em, and the vast majority have amounted to slamming Tubby Smith's coaching, recruting, strategy, style of play, substitution patterns, conditioning methods, assistant coaches--anything and everything.

You made those 3200 posts during a very subpar season after UK had been seeded #1, #1 (the overall #1) and #2 in the last three NCAA tournaments and was a double OT game from the Final Four just last March. You ignore all of that, however, because it does not advance your agenda. Your Tubby Smith comparisons are always to what I call the Golden Age of modern UK basketball, the latter part of the Pitino era, a period of unprecedented success in the entire history of UK hoops.

Maybe you are so young that the 90's are all you know. Many of the rest of us, though, are able to context Tubby Smith's performance against some other years that were mighty lean. We remember when Adolph went 13-13 with Riley, Dampier and Jaracz as returning All-Americans; when Joe B. also went 13-13 when Grevey, Flynn, Jimmy Dan and Guyette were juniors; and being relegated to the NIT when Givens, Robey, Phillips and Lee were sophomores.

We also remember the cheating and the shame on the University that resulted.

I believe that Tubby Smith is a wonderful steward for our basketball program. He conducts himself with class and he gives of himself to the community. He conducts an honest program and he wins in an era of great parity and fewer scholarships than any UK coach ever had. He is respected around the country and IMO he is deserving of respect at home.



This amounts to blah blah blah.

Unprecedented? I would say that Rupp himself set the precedent in the 40s/50s. A stretch of Ten years wherein Rupp won four Titles. That would exceed a stretch of 7 years with two titles and four Final Fours.

But that's just me.

Tubby is not getting closer to a Final Four. Hence, the perception of decline.

Tubby still has recruited to the effect of not repairing the most glaring deficiency on his roster. Still no clue how or whom to fill that great big hole. No PF. Weak SFs playing as PFs.

If Bobby Perry continues to improve and can be consistent...perhaps he can bandage that hole.

Tubby needs to get it together. This is not Tulsa. This is not Georgia.

The goals are not the same. The success and the tradtion of success is not at the same level. Expectations are greater because of this.

It's time Tubby came to that realization. He ain't in Kansas anymore. Maybe we need the Wizard to pull him behind the curtain and inform Tubby of this.

Unbiased graphical representation of UK Coaches since 1931.

http://www.21stcenturypaladin.com/pics/2006/03/kentucky_winloss_lg.gif




Proves my point perfectly. Thank you.

[RaleighCat]

catfando wrote: I don't think Tubby realizes the gravity of the situation at UK. I don't think he realizes that UK ain't Tulsa, it ain't Georgia. We don't care about winning percentage or conference titles, or regular season records like other schools do. Dean Smith is a prime example of that, to me. He got way more credit than he deserved. Considering he had some of the best talent every year and managed to win 2 championsips in 40 years. He wouldn't have lasted at UK. We set the precedent. We want to be feared by our opponents. Not considered another game on their schedule, like we were this year. We should be able to have the best of the best in players, and in coaches. But players (hansbrough for one) would rather play somewhere else now. Coaches, good ones, are not hired to be a part of this program (by Tubby). To me, he lacks a hunger for being the best. He is satisfied with the status quo, just like he is about the type of player he recruits. It's just not a winning combination in my book. Great man, but not a great coach IMO.

Nice post. I agree completely.

[RaleighCat]

blueheretic wrote: Caveman Catfan wrote: Tubby was a double overtime with a chance for the last shot away from a final four just last year. That is as close to the final four that one can get without making it.
Tubby is always a {pick your filler} away from the Final Four--a Bogans ankle injury, a double over time win, a Power Forward...an alchemist.

Or he played the ultimate National Champion to the wire or some such thing.

Those are great excuses but they aren't going to win any National Championships.

He needs to get off of the "I think I can train" and get to doing the things that he needs to do to win. A good start would be efficient and consistent recruiting.
Quite true, quite true.

[RCS]

catfando wrote:

When was the last time we went into a game with a top opponent, and actually were feeling and thinking along the lines of , We gonna wax their butts

2003. That team dominated people and I frankly thought they could whip anyone in the country, soundly, and I still to this day think they could if Bogans didn't get hurt. Duke has lost in the Sweet 16 4 out of 5 years, does that mean they are also on the decline? UK has done a lot of winning the last 3 years but 1 down year and suddenly it is a pattern of decline? How is one year a pattern? Did the last 3 years not happen? We were 1 injury and 1 shot away from Final 4s. Obviously we did not get them and so he were are, but if that is not getting close to final 4s as you suggest, what is?

People can claim they know we will suck next year, but you have no idea. There is a very good chance that Morris becomes a dominate big man and Crawford develops into a prolific scorer. I would say both of those things are more likely than UK becoming an NIT team. Going into 2003 everyone, and I mean everyone, thought it would be the worst UK team in 20 years and they were the #1 overall seed and #1 in the country for a good part of the year. Next year we will be talented and athletic and experiencedand if things go well, we will be very good. That is my opinion, but is certainly not a fact, just like the people saying we are going to suck next year. If we sign Smith or Arthur (unlikely) we will be even better.

Just so people don't think I am an opologist, I thought Tubby did a bad job with a flawed team. Clearly he failed to sign enough athletes and had no PF that should be playing in the SEC. His coached left a lot to be desired and he seemed as confused as anyone about the whole situation. All that said, I think we will be much, much better next year.

[poodoo]

RCS wrote: catfando wrote:

When was the last time we went into a game with a top opponent, and actually were feeling and thinking along the lines of , We gonna wax their butts

2003. That team dominated people and I frankly thought they could whip anyone in the country, soundly, and I still to this day think they could if Bogans didn't get hurt. Duke has lost in the Sweet 16 4 out of 5 years, does that mean they are also on the decline? UK has done a lot of winning the last 3 years but 1 down year and suddenly it is a pattern of decline? How is one year a pattern? Did the last 3 years not happen? We were 1 injury and 1 shot away from Final 4s. Obviously we did not get them and so he were are, but if that is not getting close to final 4s as you suggest, what is?

People can claim they know we will suck next year, but you have no idea. There is a very good chance that Morris becomes a dominate big man and Crawford develops into a prolific scorer. I would say both of those things are more likely than UK becoming an NIT team. Going into 2003 everyone, and I mean everyone, thought it would be the worst UK team in 20 years and they were the #1 overall seed and #1 in the country for a good part of the year. Next year we will be talented and athletic and experiencedand if things go well, we will be very good. That is my opinion, but is certainly not a fact, just like the people saying we are going to suck next year. If we sign Smith or Arthur (unlikely) we will be even better.

Just so people don't think I am an opologist, I thought Tubby did a bad job with a flawed team. Clearly he failed to sign enough athletes and had no PF that should be playing in the SEC. His coached left a lot to be desired and he seemed as confused as anyone about the whole situation. All that said, I think we will be much, much better next year.



Excellent response, RCS. Too, I, likewise, have posted that I feel Tubby did not doa good job this particular season (and I feel sure Tubby himself feels the same).As you are saying,we were not as athletic assome other teams in the SECalone, besides our having missed out on askilled power forward,for which Tubby is indeed responsible. Toignore the pastthree seasons of Tubby-coached teams, though, makesno sense to me.As I always say, the truth usually lies somewhere in the middle, and that's where I happen to think it lies on this issue.

I notice that you saythat you THINK we will be"much,much better" next season.Ihappen to THINK the same. The point is that those areONLY our OPINIONS, just assomeof the contrasting posts are alsoONLY OPINIONS.None of us KNOW whatnext season will bring.I wish everyone would realize that. :(

[PhatNastyCat]

I can't argue against Tubby's winning percentage, and yes that is something to be proud of. But that winning percentage isn't attracting players. What I don't understand is why the top players don't appear interested in playing for Tubby Smith.

I already accepted that UK was not going to sign anyone from the 2006 McDAA squad. Then I opened up my Parade magazine on Sunday looking over the list of Parade All-American teams. Not one kid with Kentucky as his school of destination. Many are excited about this year's recruiting class and I do like a number of the players, but I certainly wonder why not a one is even on the 4th team for the Parade list. Why not one was in serious contention for the McDAA game.

To me, it's about respect. Do the top players respect Kentucky basketball enough to want to come play for the Wildcats?Whywill a kid go to Florida St or Miami over Kentucky?To me, thisis an indicator that something is off. When you have to beg kids to play at Kentucky and you still can't get them to come, something is wrong. UNC has less NCAA titles, Final Four appearances, tourney wins, and over-all wins than UK and yet they are on nearly every list as a top destination regardless of potential playing time. They are loaded this year...absolutely loaded. And I have never thought that highly of Roy Williams. Now I wonder if I over-valued Tubby.

Find me one person in the national media who didn't question the talent at Kentucky. That's all we heard. "This team just isn't very talented", was the consistent word. Heck, UAB was the heavy favorite in the first round. Are you serious? How is Kentucky being shown so little respect? And to think Kentucky isn't even sniffing any preseason top 10's for next year.

The media doesn't respect the program, top recruits are not interested in Kentucky, we take solice in the fact that we played a #1 seed close and proved the naysayers wrong by beating UAB...well I guess some have a right to wonder what exactly Tubby is up to.

I have always liked Tubby, I really do. But there is legit reason to be alarmed. I am less concerned with one down season as I am with the loss of respect for the program. That is something Tubby must change. There is a difference between being a coach and a leader. Tubby may be a good coach, but Iam concerned abouthis ability to be the leader ofthis program.He needs to recognize his shortcomings and surround himself with people who have strengths where he has weaknesses. That takes leadership. If he doesn't have the right staff, then he needs to build one. If he doesn't have the right players, then he needs to be accountable. Again, that takes leadership. Tubby needs to be a leader and rebuild the respect and value of the program by any means required to do so.

If kids want to transfer from the program, then Tubby failed to either set the right level of expectations upfront or he failed tomanage to expectations. Is their clarity? Is their unity? Again, that's leadership. Do kids buy into what you are asking them to do and fight like crazy for you. Will they run through a wall for you?

Some have said before that leadership was lost with the graduation of Chuck Hayes. Should a player be the sole point of leadership on the floor and in the lockerroom? Certainly you need players who are leaders, but it is more important that that leadership begins a the top, with the head coach.

I am certainly not saying Tubby has to leave for things to get improve, but I do think he needs to make changes to his staff. That would be good leadership in my opinion. I want the program to be respected like it should be and for kids to make Kentucky a priority when it comes to looking for a place to play college hoops.

-PNC

[RCS]

I too think it is odd that we have, other than 1 year, struggled to recruit despite our success the last couple of years. I do think that is cause for concern and it is a poor reflection on Tubby, IMO. I don't know the answer for that. I do think this incoming class is good, but like you, I wonder how Tubby managed not to sign a quality PF for the last 4 years. That is a long time and is particularly disturbing because it was a priority for the last 3years and a clear need. Even if you thought Thomas would be better than he is there is still no back up other than Sims who clearly was plan Z in the grand scheme of recruiting. I think Tubby needs to take a long look in the mirror as far as his method of recruiting and his priority on recruiting. BothI think need a major upgrade.

It is taking that information and deciding that UK is destined for mediocrity that I think is a bit of a stretch and that was my main point in my other post.

[lighthouse]

Has anyone heard any news about Sims' talk with his former coach? I hope he decides to stay.

[WildcatDan]

PhatNastyCat wrote: UNC has less NCAA titles, Final Four appearances, tourney wins, and over-all wins than UK and yet they are on nearly every list as a top destination regardless of potential playing time. They are loaded this year...absolutely loaded. And I have never thought that highly of Roy Williams. Now I wonder if I over-valued Tubby.



E S P N

[RCS]

UNC has always recruited more high profile players than UK. Also you have the Michael Jordan effect. ESPN doesn't hurt, but I think there is more to it. BTW, if you have ever been to UNC campus it is absolutely beautiful. I can understand why kids want to got there.

Despite the higher profile athletes UK has had more success than UNC in both the short and long term. They have signed 55+ Mc D AA to UK's 27 yet have the same number of championships in that time period(30 years).

[I. Melvin]

ALL of the above and The Michael Jordan Effect (while Michael was still in his prime) didn't seem to bother our previous coach.

The Year of No Excuses starts now. For both major sports.

[BigblueDrew]

I. Melvin wrote: ALL of the above and The Michael Jordan Effect (while Michael was still in his prime) didn't seem to bother our previous coach.

The Year of No Excuses starts now. For both major sports.


Where Tubby Smith is concerned, the excuses will continue long after he finally chooses to leave, JMO.

[Buddah]

BigblueDrew wrote: I. Melvin wrote: ALL of the above and The Michael Jordan Effect (while Michael was still in his prime) didn't seem to bother our previous coach.

The Year of No Excuses starts now. For both major sports.


Where Tubby Smith is concerned, the excuses will continue long after he finally chooses to leave, JMO.
I agree, as i have been doing alot lately with youdrew.