Something I've Always Thought Was Strange

[Will Lavender]

I've always found this to be a strange phenomenon.

It's this: when a UK fan says, "You love/defend/take up for Tubby" as if that's a negative thing.

OF COURSE I take up for Tubby. He's the coach of my team. And I'll take up for the next guy after Tubby.

It's one thing to bend the numbers so that you're a homer. I understand that perfectly, and of course on a message board homerism gets...boring. But there are certain numbers that are sort of in the middle, where there's a gray area, and a certain portion of fans will not let you give Tubby any benefit of the doubt.

This, to me, is very odd. We wouldn't take this from an opposing fan, so why do we just assume that it's simply normal behavior for a UK fan?

Can someone explain it to me?

[AugustaDan]

I think it would be interesting to implement a Tubby Support rating system. :)

Each poster would rate himself or herself on a scale from 1 to 10. "1" would be the type of poster who responds to the question "what can we do to get back to the final four in the next five years" with "fire the coach." "10" would be someone who unquestionably supports Tubby Smith, i.e. denies there's been a problem with recruiting, doesn't think there was a coaching problem last season, etc.

Even better would be a "challenge system." For example someone might give themselves a 5, but everyone else on the board knows they are a 1. Someone challenges the rating and the board votes.

This rating could be posted under the username so that when you read the post, you can take it in better context.

I would give myself a 6, I think. I think Tubby is a fine coach, but there have been some real problems that I would like him to fix.

I think both extremes (1 and 10) are irrational and ridiculous. And, finally, in response to your query, to someone who's a 1, a poster who's a 6 looks like a 10.

[RxRusty]

Interesting idea. I'd probably give myself a "7". I think Tubby is a great coach but we have had a few problems.

[Cincy110]

Is the rating for "current" status or over the history of his tenure?

Currently - 7

Whole Tenure - 9

[fanaticfan]

I would give myself an 8, because I really like Tubby, the man, Iwas a little disapointed withTubby, the coach thispast season, but I have high hopes for the future! Ever the optimist!:)

[Will Lavender]

Cincy110 wrote: Is the rating for "current" status or over the history of his tenure?

Currently - 7

Whole Tenure - 9


This is about where I am.

I probably would be closer to 8 on the "Whole Tenure" scale, though.

[ukbob]

Will Lavender wrote: I've always found this to be a strange phenomenon.

It's this: when a UK fan says, "You love/defend/take up for Tubby" as if that's a negative thing.

OF COURSE I take up for Tubby. He's the coach of my team. And I'll take up for the next guy after Tubby.

It's one thing to bend the numbers so that you're a homer. I understand that perfectly, and of course on a message board homerism gets...boring. But there are certain numbers that are sort of in the middle, where there's a gray area, and a certain portion of fans will not let you give Tubby any benefit of the doubt.

This, to me, is very odd. We wouldn't take this from an opposing fan, so why do we just assume that it's simply normal behavior for a UK fan?

Can someone explain it to me?

It is the dividing line in the camps. There is hardly a middle ground these days. Deserved or not, this is what his tenure has done here. Not good, IMO.

[SamKat]

I'm at the dividing line with a 6. Great man and great coach, but needs improved talent on his teams. That is , ultimately, the head coach's responsibility.

[tauzreborn]

Excellent thought! I'll take a 9. Although there have been a few mishaps in recent times, I think that Tubby has done a great job of keeping it incognito. I feel that many of our problems stemmed from defections and that is something Tubby could not have prevented entirely.

So many coaches would put the blame on assistants or those said defections, not Tubby. If we had a coach with any less class, the pressure at UK may have lead to violations and eventually probation. He has done things the right way, maybe not the best, but as a UK fan I will never be satisfied until #8 is hung, and then #9, and man-oh-man I cannot wait for #10.

[poodoo]

dxwils3 wrote: I think it would be interesting to implement a Tubby Support rating system. :)

Each poster would rate himself or herself on a scale from 1 to 10. "1" would be the type of poster who responds to the question "what can we do to get back to the final four in the next five years" with "fire the coach." "10" would be someone who unquestionably supports Tubby Smith, i.e. denies there's been a problem with recruiting, doesn't think there was a coaching problem last season, etc.

Even better would be a "challenge system." For example someone might give themselves a 5, but everyone else on the board knows they are a 1. Someone challenges the rating and the board votes.

This rating could be posted under the username so that when you read the post, you can take it in better context.

I would give myself a 6, I think. I think Tubby is a fine coach, but there have been some real problems that I would like him to fix.

I think both extremes (1 and 10) are irrational and ridiculous. And, finally, in response to your query, to someone who's a 1, a poster who's a 6 looks like a 10.


Good question, Will, and neat response, dxwils3, especially your last statement. :)

Too, FWIW, I suspect some of those 1's would rate me a 10 (on this criteria alone, of course :ggrin:)because of my being positive and often defending Coach Smith. Of course, in realityI have also bemoaned Tubby's lack of getting a top power forward to sign and his overall performance this past season, so a 10 would not be at all fair based on all the evidence, in my opinion.

I honestly don't know what number I would give myself, but it would definitely be at least a 6 because I still support and believe in Tubby,but less than a 9 because of the recruiting lapses, the lack of communication skills, and some possible player management issues. Regardless, like dxwils3, I still think Coach Smith is, overall, a fine coach, and I will continue to defend him against whatfalls into the category of veryextreme, unfair (in my eyes, as based on the accomplishments)criticism.

Too, asWill says, what is so wrong with that!Tubby Smith is our coach and is a highly respected coach by the nation, besides being a fine human being. Not to defend him against what I perceive to be extreme, unfair criticism would be wrong, as I see it! Meanwhile I will also say that some changes need to be made next season, which Tubby himself has said. No, I haven't given up. I look forward to seeing how the team performs next season, especially late in the season. :)

[Calsegs]

I second Poodoo's position.

[audacious1]

Before last season I was a "9". Now I'm an "8".

[Will Lavender]

I could even go year by year in regards to this "system" of dxwils'.

1998: 10
1999: 7
2000: 5
2001: 7
2002: 3
2003: 9
2004: 7
2005: 8
2006: 2
_______

= 58

Average: 6.4

That's a little lower than I thought, but it's probably a better measure of where I am in my "Tubby loyalism." :D:cool:

[DCWildcat]

I'd consider myself an 8-9. My propensity to judge coaches by total season performance rather than tourney success putst me at odds with just about everyone.

[Mark Blueblood]

Well, I've been called a "homer", "apologist", "lover" so much that it rolls off my back.

I've never denied that I think the man can flat out COACH - with anyone. Better bench coach than Pitino - maybe ain't even close. But he isn't the recruiter that Rick is. Can be said in both categories vs several coaches, I suppose.

Class act - represents the university and the program with integrity. In college athletics that's worth something.

I also feel that recruiting needs to be stepped up. No question about it. So....in one category he rates higher than perhaps another.

He's a 10 - 10 - 7 in the 3 categories I've mentioned. If you want to average, then it's a 9. Don't know, if overall, at least currently I'd rate him that high. But let's say a solid 8 - 9. (Now, how's that for wishy-washy?)

[wildcatfaninnc]

I consider myself a 5.

Idon't know Tubby personally but I'msure he's a great human being. Hedoes alot for children and other charitable organizations. He seems to be a all around great guy.

As far as his coaching of UK goes.....I just don't think he's getting the job done. I could elaborate on this but I don't think this thread was started to become a "Why I don't like Tubby Smith as our Coach" thread.

[ukbob]

Used to be a 9...now between a 6 and 7. Capability to get it back to 9 again, IMO.

No coach is a 10....none.

[SamKat]

Adolph was in charge of the teams (with Harry). I'd give him a 10. Pitino was an 8, but dropped to a minus category when he made the wrong job choice coming back to college basketball.

Just an opinion. We all have 'em.

[SunBaller]

Of the 326 NCAA Division I basketball coaches, I believe Tubby is within the Top 30. I'm not sure where he llies within that Top 30 Coaches. I'm impressed with the George Mason coach who did what we couldn't do and I'm impressed with all the coaches who did more with younger, less experienced, and supposedly less talented players such as coaches Williams, Donavan, etc. I believe (as does everyone else) that college basketball coaching requires several attributes. I see the following aspects of coaching as necessary and equalto make an "outstanding" college basketball coach.

Recruiting is not black and white. Recruitingtalent is a no-brainer, but recruiting the right players at the right positions with the right chemistry takes a special talent.

Practice shouldn't be overlooked or taken for granted. Practice includes conditioning in my analysis. A coaches system and methods must be emphasized here. There's no room for dissension. When a system is practicedit must be repetitive to ensure everyone understands it and could do it in their sleep. A "system"must fit the player's physical abilities as well as their personalities (See Recruiting). Individual game preparationis a key. Each player must know their role defensively and offensivelyand that role could change for each game. They must know why they have a specific role and buy in to it.

Motivation may be the toughest of all the aspects of coaching. Many NBA wannabe's motivate themselves in devoping their individual skills, but motivating an NBA hopeful to "buy into" a coach's system (See Practice) has to be difficult. A basketball coachat UK has a large advantage over many college basketball coaches. Kentucky Basketball is Life. The fans and alumni worship UK Basketball and therefore the players are treated like gods and that alone motivates the playersmore than many colleges who don't have great Sports' Programs or have othersports that are adored more than basketball such as Texas, Florida, Oklahoma, Michigan, USC, and many others. Motivating to practice and learn is just as important as motivating players to excel in games.

Game Coaching requires quick and efficient decision making. Requires focus to see changes in defenses and offenses and make correct adjustments.

A. Recruiting (Tubby 4.0 out of 10.0IMO)

1. Talent

2. Position

3. Chemistry

B. Practice (Tubby 6.0 out of 10.0IMO)

1. Conditioning/Strength

2. "System" Repetition/Preparation

a. Defense

b. Offense

3. Game Preparation

a. Individual Defensive roles

b. Individual Offensive roles

c. Opposing Team Knowledge/Preparation

C. Motivation (Tubby 7.0 out of 10.0IMO)

1. Individual Skills Development

2. Team Skills/Roles

3. Winning Attitude (UK Fans/Alumni improve Tubby's score)

D. Game Coaching (Tubby 8.0 out of 10.0IMO)

1. Defensive Adjustments

2. Offensive Adjustments

3. Substitution Patterns

Tubby Overall (IMO): 6.25 out of 10.0

[StanTheMan10]

I will support whoever is in that seat on the UK bench. Will I always like what happens? Of course not. But I feel that badmouthing the coach does nothing but negative things for the program.

I'm not the AD, I'm not a big time booster, and I have no pull whatsoever, so my opinion (and MANY others) really do not matter. Crying and bellyaching about it usually does nothing but make people tired of listening to you, so sometimes it is best to hold your tounge and say nothing at all.

That said, I'd say I'm about an 8 on the "scale".

[DCWildcat]

Sadly, basketball, like most other things in life, is a game shrouded in the grey. Black and white opinions oversimplify the truth to the extent that it's no longer true at all. Yet stupid people perceive a strength from absolutist positions. They're great for getting riled up and poor for reaching logical conclusions. Extremists on both sides are bad about this.

[sojourner]

Sunballer, you rate Tubby as one of the top 30 and yet you give him a 6.25? What is your average score for a coach? 5? If so how many coaches must be packed into the little space between 5 and 6.25. That is one severely sloped bell-shaped curve there.

[cnice11]

TOP 30! I'm not a huge Tubby fan, but believe he is still a top 5 coach. The only thing that really bugs me about Tubby, is his inability to get a power forward, we just have had average power forwards, if that.

[poodoo]

cnice11 wrote: TOP 30! I'm not a huge Tubby fan, but believe he is still a top 5 coach. The only thing that really bugs me about Tubby, is his inability to get a power forward, we just have had average power forwards, if that.


FWIW, I, too, still think Tubby is a top five coach. Also like you, crice, Tubby's inability to get a top power forward has concerned me. With a top power forward last season UK is definitely competing seriously for a national championship (and that position concerns me again this season).

Giving myself a number in regard to my confidence in Tubby is harder, though. Like ukbob and others, I would have given him a nine (no coach deserves a ten, in my opinion) before last season. Last season dropped me to an eight, I guess, if I were really forced to put a number on my opinion of his coaching. There is no way I would drop to below a seven in my faith in Tubby because of one disappointing season. Too, I strongly suspect I would still be a nine if Tubby had landed a top power forward forlast year's team.

EIGHT-minus from this former teacher. :)

[poodoo]

SamKat wrote: I'm at the dividing line with a 6. Great man and great coach, but needs improved talent on his teams. That is , ultimately, the head coach's responsibility.


While I'm not down to a six, you make an excellent point, SamKat.

[bluegrassking]

Dale Brown being a one and Rupp and Wooden being tens, I'd give Smith a 5 or a Herb Sendek.

Not UK quality, time to punt.

[GStephenA]

I'll go with a 7 overall. There are some serious problems, but I think he can fix them. Ask me again next year.